13 Colonies Quenched!

by **Industrial Helix** on Sat Nov 21, 2009 2:45 pm

I see it. They're two different font sizes. Better now?

Click image to enlarge.

by **natty dread** on Sat Nov 21, 2009 2:53 pm

Lol. I guess I was wrong then. Yeah, that looks better.

by **the.killing.44** on Sat Nov 21, 2009 5:26 pm

jefjef wrote:OK. Why is the 2 so much larger than the 3 in the legend? And then smaller in the other map? Is it just an optical illusion?

On the small, at least, it was the font. It's something called text figures, in which some numbers are aligned on the line differently than others. Nothing is wrong. I guess on the large it was. IH, if you really want to fix it decrease the font point and up the baseline leading, but I wouldn't change it.

by **Industrial Helix** on Sat Nov 21, 2009 6:10 pm

Killing informs me that my 2 isn't italicized... well, it is now.

Click image to enlarge.

by **isaiah40** on Sun Nov 22, 2009 9:21 pm

Here I am looking at this map at one thing jumps out at me, literally. The army circles on the French ships are glaring like a large spot light. Is there any way you could move them down a little or tone them down? My eyes want to go there every time I come and take a look.

Edit: Something like the level of the ones on the British ships maybe?

by **J to the D** on Tue Nov 24, 2009 10:06 am

Hey,

I know I haven't commented on this map before, but I've been checking up on it now and then. It looks great, but the French flags are really distracting. Perhaps you could either change to something more identifiably French, or something more historically accurate.

The most accurate would be a plain white flag (a delicious irony for the country that would come to be called surrender monkeys) as seen on wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:White_ensign_Battle_martinique_1779_img_9388.jpg

As for something more identifiable, but less accurate, how about something from the 17th century section at this site: http://tmg110.tripod.com/royfr8.htm. On some other forum that I closed the tab already, someone quoted one of Washington's assistants saying that many French ships were using the white ensign with 3 large gold fleur-de-lis.

Anyways, keep up the good work,

-Joe

by **Industrial Helix** on Tue Nov 24, 2009 10:25 am

Yeah, I tried the white flag but I think we decided it emasculated the French too much to keep. Which is where the field of fleur de lic came from. But, as it turns out, gold doesn't show up on white too well so I went with orange. The blue might be an option though.

by **Industrial Helix** on Tue Nov 24, 2009 11:12 am

Well... I thought I'd try the blue and gold on the French ships and see what I could come up with. Turns out its a pain to find a French Monarch flag waving in the wind, I've pretty much fabricated all the other historical flags I've had to use on other maps. BUT, somewhere in the back of my mind I recalled seeing a French blue and gold Fleur de Lic flag waving int he wind when I was at Mont St. Michel in France and struck by the rarity of the site, took numerous photos. Finally, 5 years later, that photo has come in handy. Quite proud of myself, really.

I have to say, the blue looks 20 times better than the white and orange and it fits in with the map much better. Does this have the approval of the foundry?

I fixed the French ship as per Isiah's suggestion... turns out I dodged the ship as opposed to putting an army circle over it. Foolish. I just brought the original file in and shrunk it down again.

Click image to enlarge.

Click image to enlarge.

by **isaiah40** on Tue Nov 24, 2009 7:26 pm

Thank you! Glad to see those spotlights turned down :lol:

Looking good, I don't see anything else at the moment, so let me see ... where did I put that Gr stamp!? :lol:

by **cairnswk** on Tue Nov 24, 2009 8:18 pm

isaiah40 wrote:...so let me see ... where did I put that Gr stamp!?

Yes, what have you done with it? :lol:

IH, Very nice effort indeed =D>

by **Industrial Helix** on Tue Nov 24, 2009 9:19 pm

Yeah, good eye Isaiah, I think its an improvement.

Thanks for the support Cairns!

by **Industrial Helix** on Sun Nov 29, 2009 3:50 pm

Interesting poll results... 7 foundry lurkers do not want this map and 27 do. To be honest, I was kind of surprised 20% don't care for it since no one has expressed such views in the thread. But I think 80% who do want it gives it the impetus to go on. Now where's that Graphics stamp?

by **jefjef** on Sun Nov 29, 2009 6:23 pm

You have the mis-matched numbers on the one map again.

by **AndyDufresne** on Tue Dec 01, 2009 5:29 pm

I'm not sure if it's just me, the the title and legend with the flag are a little much. Difficult to distinguish the text, or at least, not exactly a quick read. Perhaps a softer/less contrasting image behind the text?

The text on the small map I've still never been a fan of.

There is something else about the graphics that irk me like a splinter. Maybe the sparseness of graphics? Or "simpler" style? But I know the simpler style can work---Land and Sea is a good example, and I like it on that map. But something about this map gets in the way of that. However, I think it may not be the over all graphics, but just rather those elements of the text and the legend, that make me feel that way.

--Andy

by **cairnswk** on Tue Dec 01, 2009 7:09 pm

Click image to enlarge.

IH, i'm sooking at this after a while away from it....
1. I know it's probably deliberate, but you've got a drop shadow around the legend insert, but none on the actual coastline.
I think this is causing some flatness in the actual map perspective.
2. the text on the flag is a little too blended (and i think we've been here before), perhaps reduce the transparancy of the flag so that the text stands out more.
3. top left corner of the flag, there seems to be the corner of a shape sitting under the cut corner of the flag
4. what is the dark spot on For Prince George
5. i prefer the blue french flags, perhaps simply toned down, the white ones make the overall scene move towards the bland end of the scale.
6. Suggestion - have you experimented with any elevation techniques that would give the land a lift somewho to create undulation in some of the territories and particularly on the empty green

by **Industrial Helix** on Tue Dec 01, 2009 9:56 pm

Well, I'm definitely getting some solid suggestions here, some easily implemented and others that are gonna require some tooling around. I'll see what I can come up with. Thanks a lot Andy and Cairns!

by **pamoa** on Wed Dec 02, 2009 2:45 am

maybe your dotted line is just too contemporary
why not using a line made of segments of thin lines instead of dots
think your a drawing it with a pen not a computer

by **Industrial Helix** on Thu Dec 03, 2009 6:47 pm

Well my original intent was to make the map look more like a pen drawing than computer one, hence why its so flat.... but graphical suggestions to add drop shadow on the legend really kind of skewed it away. I wanted to do dashed lines instead of dots but for the life of me couldn't figure out how. I know how now and I think I might give it a try.

As for adding terrain formations, I've been giving it some thought and the only addition in this area that I would be willing to make would be to use pen style elevations, shown here:

Click image to enlarge.

Bringing in the Appalachians would definitely make the far left more interesting and it might spice up the playable areas too. The reason I'm opposed to doing anything like full on realistic terrain elevations is that I think, a) it would be too distracting and b) it will break from the intended theme of the map.

So my plan from here forward is to steer it more toward the pen drawn look which will cut out most drop shadows yet figure out a way to separate the mini-map and instructions... .

So what I want to be discussed are

1) Is a mini-map really necessary or are the different colored colonies and the chart enough? (Assuming a note is made of Massachusetts)

2) Should pen style elevations be added into this map?

Perhaps I'll give it a shot on Georgia or something and throw it in to help people to decide...

by **cubfanpgh** on Thu Dec 03, 2009 8:50 pm

Industrial Helix wrote:So what I want to be discussed are

1) Is a mini-map really necessary or are the different colored colonies and the chart enough? (Assuming a note is made of Massachusetts)

2) Should pen style elevations be added into this map?

Perhaps I'll give it a shot on Georgia or something and throw it in to help people to decide...

1) I'm feeling ambivalent about the mini-map. Sorry for not being helpful about this one.

2) I say go for it! What I especially like about this map is that it is a map. Pen style elevations can add to the feel of the map, along with helping to explain why the map's western border is so awkward.

by **Industrial Helix** on Sat Dec 05, 2009 11:29 pm

Ok, I made most of the changes suggested but have run into some problems with the pen style elevations. So flags toned down, rules background toned down, Fort Prince George dot gone and that shape towards the upper left of the rules is Lake Erie.

As for the pen style elevations, I can't seem to get a good pen stroke out of photoshop, plus, to my eye so far, it just stands out of the map as unnecessary. I don't want to do 3d modeling or anything because I think it would depart too much from the already established style of this map. I want a flat map, as if it were a real map. The rules and mini-map already break this, on the suggestion of others though. I think overall it is for the better as those areas do need to break from the rest of the map somehow.

I dunno what I'm doing wrong here. I think I've met all of the criteria of a graphically sound map. Everything is legible and fits fine.

Click image to enlarge.

Click image to enlarge.

1) Image must present itself as clear and legible.
2) Both large and small maps athetics must be to a presentable foundry standard and must also satisfy the community at large.
3) Cartographers must, where possible, reduce any disadvantage that can be caused to a colorblind individual.
4) All map makers are expected to take all graphical comments into consideration and must either accepted them or give sound reasoning as to why not to take paticular advice.

I think it meets all these criteria save for a few clean ups, such as the numbers or the French flags. So what's the problem?

by **cairnswk** on Sun Dec 06, 2009 12:25 am

^^^ I can live with your desires for the map, problem for me is that the mini-map isn't flat, so you don't really have a flat map, and this itself for me detracts from the overall picture.
If you really want a flat map, then i feel you should remove the drop shadows...but that's just my opinion.

by **Industrial Helix** on Mon Dec 07, 2009 11:50 pm

Thanks Cairns, and I think you're right. If its going to be a map, then it needs to be a map. I tried adding a separate piece of parchment and it didn't work... nothing short of an overhaul will do.

Well, maybe not overhaul, but more like graphical coagulation.

Aside from the obvious changes, I tackled a few minor ones as well. The stamp in the upper corner is from the 1765 stamp act, repealed by the time of the war, but period none-the-less and most certainly a cause of the war. The letter, I believe is clear in how it explains the rules and the minimap now makes sense as it is referenced in the letter.

While I am quite unhappy with the fact that all maps save for those in the Final Forge will be halted until 2010, I would like to believe that it is possible that this map make it to the FF before the weekend. I think it is entirely possible and plausible as the map meets all the requirements laid out in the handbook and guide for getting a stamp. Mr. Benn himself said on page 17, Oct. 2 that this map was

"...really not far away from the finished article now."

and then a month later said on page 19, Nov. 4

You're so very nearly there...

He at one point suggested that a piece of parchment be used to separate the island minimap from the rest of the map. As you can see, this has now been thoroughly addressed whereas before I couldn't figure out how. Other suggestions to change the font on the small map have been made, and as you will see in the below images, one small map retains the scroll font and the other the print font. The print font on the small map will be my choice for entering FF. The scrolly font small map is there just because I like it

This map has been in the works since February of 2009. The draft stage was slow and took up the most time, but game play was quick and I have been quick to address and change every comment and critique of this map during the 4 months it has been under graphical review. This final version, I am quite satisfied with and I believe it covers all problems mentioned in the thread. Yes, it took 4 months to get to this point, I understand that, but I believe it has reached its end and the best possible version of this map is now before us.

So, in conclusion, I believe this map is ready for the forge and I think the foundry moderators ought to give serious consideration to this map making the move at this point.

Click image to enlarge.

Click image to enlarge.

This one isn't my small, I'm just letting you all know that this is how the scrolly font looks at this point and I am willing to go with it should demand be strong enough.

Click image to enlarge.

by **isaiah40** on Tue Dec 08, 2009 12:49 pm

I like this version a whole lot better!! I like the fact how you ingeniously included your signature as part of the letter =D>

Unfortunately, I was the one to lose Mr.Benn's GR stamp

Hopefully he has found a new one and gets this stamped really soon, as I, amongst others, want to get this going so we can play it!

Good work, and looking forward to seeing it in FF soon!

by **cairnswk** on Tue Dec 08, 2009 2:01 pm

IH....
New version, nice work but just a couple of small tweaks that would be worth considering (and i don't want to hold you up from advancing)
1. the stamp top left corner, is it possible to center the stamp on that parchment
2. the pearl lines between ships, is it possible to just move them away from the parchments a touch
3. North Carolina text on small legend isn't scrolly while the rest are on the scrolly small version
4. i'd tone down the drop shadows on the stamp (top left) and mini-map parchments just a touch to make them similar to the letter drop shadow.
5, Flag change? I take it the Union Jack is more appropriate?

I'd prefer to see the small scrolly version go forth as to me it is legible and consistent with the large, but understand if others and yourself prefer the other small non-scrolly text. As stated by isaiah40, nice touch with Sir I Helix.

And yes i'd support a Gr stamp and move to FF before the foundry closes down for Xmas, but you might have to PM the Boys in Blue.

by **isaiah40** on Tue Dec 08, 2009 6:16 pm

Just noticed one little thing. You have the burnt type edges on the left, bottom and right sides, but I don't see it on the top edge. I don't know if that was intentional or not, it just looks a little funny with it not on the top.

13 Colonies Quenched!

Re: [Poll] 13 Colonies [D, Gp] 11/20 p. 22 Do you want this map?

Re: [Poll] 13 Colonies [D, Gp] 11/20 p. 22 Do you want this map?

Re: [Poll] 13 Colonies [D, Gp] 11/20 p. 22 Do you want this map?

Re: [Poll] 13 Colonies [D, Gp] 11/20 p. 22 Do you want this map?

Re: [Poll] 13 Colonies [D, Gp] 11/20 p. 22 Do you want this map?

Re: [Poll] 13 Colonies [D, Gp] 11/20 p. 22 Do you want this map?

Re: [Poll] 13 Colonies [D, Gp] 11/20 p. 22 Do you want this map?

Re: [Poll] 13 Colonies [D, Gp] 11/20 p. 22 Do you want this map?

Re: [Poll] 13 Colonies [D, Gp] 11/24 p. 23 Do you want this map?

Re: [Poll] 13 Colonies [D, Gp] 11/24 p. 23 Do you want this map?

Re: [Poll] 13 Colonies [D, Gp] 11/24 p. 23 Do you want this map?

Re: [Poll] 13 Colonies [D, Gp] 11/24 p. 23 Do you want this map?

Re: [Poll] 13 Colonies [D, Gp] 11/24 p. 23 Do you want this map?

Re: [Poll] 13 Colonies [D, Gp] p. 23 How to make the GR better?

Re: [Poll] 13 Colonies [D, Gp] 11/20 p. 22 Do you want this map?

Re: [Poll] 13 Colonies [D, Gp] p. 23 How to make the GR better?

Re: [Poll] 13 Colonies [D, Gp] p. 23 How to make the GR better?

Re: [Poll] 13 Colonies [D, Gp] p. 23 How to make the GR better?

Re: [Poll] 13 Colonies [D, Gp] p. 23 How to make the GR better?

Re: [Poll] 13 Colonies [D, Gp] p. 23 Add Mtns, subtract minimap?

Re: [Poll] 13 Colonies [D, Gp] p. 23 Add Mtns, subtract minimap?

Re: [Poll] 13 Colonies [D, Gp] p. 23 Add Mtns, subtract minimap?

Re: 13 Colonies [D, Gp] p. 24 Major Graphics Adjust, FF or Bust!

Re: 13 Colonies [D, Gp] p. 24 Major Graphics Adjust, FF or Bust!

Re: 13 Colonies [D, Gp] p. 24 Major Graphics Adjust, FF or Bust!

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