Michael J. Fox TV Ad

[Mirak]

Compassion..... do you believe that the sacrifice of life in order , not even to save another life but for nothing more than research is compassion????

But God sacrificed his son not even to save another life but for nothing more than to forgive the sins of man which he could have just forgiven anyway because he's God

You really need to phrase things less emotively...the above quote is a quite ridiculous and grotesque misrepresentation of any arguments made here...but that's about par for your "method" of debate

[jay_a2j]

Compassion..... do you believe that the sacrifice of life in order , not even to save another life but for nothing more than research is compassion????

But God sacrificed his son not even to save another life but for nothing more than to forgive the sins of man which he could have just forgiven anyway because he's God

You really need to phrase things less emotively...the above quote is a quite ridiculous and grotesque misrepresentation of any arguments made here...but that's about par for your "method" of debate

Jesus came into the world NOT to condemn it but to SAVE it.. Jesus died so that WE could live. So, Jesus did die to save lives. There can be no forgiveness of sin without the shedding of blood. *sigh

[heavycola]

I'm not complaining, jay. Just don't call me a psychopath, or accuse me of supporting the 'slaughter' of children, just because i disagree with you about what the word 'child' means.
<---- MA in English lit/journalist who feels qualified to argue definitions, especially with someone who has the spelling ability of a backwards 12 year old.

i think you should reply to Backglass' comment though:

Why not? You werent soapbox preaching about imaginary gods until a TV evangelist "healed" you. Whats the difference?

what IS the difference?

[vtmarik]

Jesus came into the world NOT to condemn it but to SAVE it.. Jesus died so that WE could live. So, Jesus did die to save lives. There can be no forgiveness of sin without the shedding of blood. *sigh

Ok, so you're against stem cell research because one of these embryos may be the reincarnated Jesus?

[strike wolf]

Okay, jay, heres a scenario. If someone has an abortion would you rather see them use that fetus for something good? or would you rather see it thrown in the trash and rot?

Personally, I hate the idea of abortions but as long as they are legal, you might as well have something good come out of them.

Secondly, this will hopefully be the last time I post in one of these threads because I don't like them for the same reason that Onlyambrose spoke against. They are interesting debates for a while then they go in a loop. Really, you guys are never going to see eye to eye so you might as well just trying.

[Backglass]

i think you should reply to Backglass' comment though:

Why not? You werent soapbox preaching about imaginary gods until a TV evangelist "healed" you. Whats the difference?

what IS the difference?

Looks like jay is giving me the silent treatment.

Actually it's a wise move on his part as his responses only make him look more zealous.

[jay_a2j]

Why not? You werent soapbox preaching about imaginary gods until a TV evangelist "healed" you. Whats the difference?

I had been a Christian for some 5 years before God healed me. And have been a Christian for about 17 since. YOU don't know what I was doing BEFORE or AFTER. That is the difference. (along with the more obvious like I'm not killing people)

[Backglass]

I had been a Christian for some 5 years before God healed me. And have been a Christian for about 17 since. YOU don't know what I was doing BEFORE or AFTER. That is the difference.

Ahhh...of course. And you KNOW everything about Michael J. Fox and his motives.

How silly of me.

[heavycola]

Okay, jay, heres a scenario. If someone has an abortion would you rather see them use that fetus for something good? or would you rather see it thrown in the trash and rot?

Personally, I hate the idea of abortions but as long as they are legal, you might as well have something good come out of them.

this is one of the most sensible and non-partisan posts in this entire thread

this is the one of the most sanctimonious and childish things yet posted in this thread

[jay_a2j]

Okay, jay, heres a scenario. If someone has an abortion would you rather see them use that fetus for something good? or would you rather see it thrown in the trash and rot?

Thats like asking if it would have been acceptable for Hitler to kill Jews if he used the bodies to feed starving children around the world?


The answer is a resounding NO.

[Backglass]

Thats like asking if it would have been acceptable for Hitler to kill Jews if he used the bodies to feed starving children around the world?

And by your same odd standards, the US eliminating Hitler would be "disgraceful" and "for political gain" because we didnt care about him BEFORE he started killing jews.

[jay_a2j]

And by your same odd standards, the US eliminating Hitler would be "disgraceful" and "for political gain" because we didnt care about him BEFORE he started killing jews.

Just say NO to drugs.

[Backglass]

IF FOX WASN'T ADVOCATING FOR PARKINSON'S before he was diagnosesed WHY DO IT NOW??????

I for one can't stand when celebrities don't give 2 cents about diseases UNTIL they get one! Where was your compassion before your diagnosis???? It just seems like self-centered, "I have it, so PLEASE help!" crap to me.

IF THE USA WASN'T ADVOCATING REMOVING HITLER before he was killing jews WHY DO IT NOW??????

I for one can't stand when countries don't give 2 cents about a group of people UNTIL they start getting killed! Where was your compassion before hitler started killing???? It just seems like self-centered, "people are being slaughtered now, so PLEASE help!" crap to me.

But thats much different isnt it jay.

Just say NO to drugs.

Well...your the admittedly addicted one. So I must agree.

[what,me worry?]

Indeed. The one that pisses me off the most is the Governator.

Yeah... hes a big Austrian guy who was great in action films. The does NOT mean he would be a good governor.

I know its a little late to respond to that but i live in Cali and he is a pretty good govenor. The best part i like about him is that he cannot be bought off by lobbyists(or secum to money scandels) because he already has more than enough money to go around

[jay_a2j]

IF THE USA WASN'T ADVOCATING REMOVING HITLER before he was killing jews WHY DO IT NOW??????

I for one can't stand when countries don't give 2 cents about a group of people UNTIL they start getting killed! Where was your compassion before hitler started killing???? It just seems like self-centered, "people are being slaughtered now, so PLEASE help!" crap to me.

But thats much different isnt it jay.

Yes, it IS different and its obvious why? (If you can't see it..... meh, I wouldn't be surprised)

[Backglass]

Yes, it IS different and its obvious why?

We took care of Hitler because it was the right thing to do EVEN THOUGH we hadnt cared about him before he started killing.

Yet you say Michael J. Fox is "disgraceful" because he didnt care about Parkinsons Disease before he got it.

All I see is your typical double standard.

[happysadfun]

There's a difference. We didn't know about Hitler's genocide too much until it surfaced, and we acted. That's different from a disesa you've known about all along.

[Backglass]

There's a difference. We didn't know about Hitler's genocide too much until it surfaced, and we acted. That's different from a disesa you've known about all along.

We waited until we had more information. As did he.

When we understood what was happening, we acted. As did he.

Yet one is "disgraceful". Double Standard.

[jay_a2j]

There's a difference. We didn't know about Hitler's genocide too much until it surfaced, and we acted. That's different from a disesa you've known about all along.

We waited until we had more information. As did he.

When we understood what was happening, we acted. As did he.

Yet one is "disgraceful". Double Standard.

We didn't wait for anything. He started attacking countries and slautering Jews and we took him out because of what he became.....this is like arguing killing murderers before they actually commit a murder!

What Parkinsons' information has surfaced since Fox was diagnosed? It was always there. Why is he concerned with it now? Because he has it. Maybe the word "disgraceful" was not the word I should have used. Maybe "convienetly aware" better fits.

[heavycola]

I believe Jay has invoked Godwin's Law - yet again - and has lost the argument, such as it was, by default. Sorry jay.

[areon]

There's a difference. We didn't know about Hitler's genocide too much until it surfaced, and we acted. That's different from a disesa you've known about all along.

Actually the world had heard reports of Jews and other minorities being forcibly removed long before WWII. Most of the concentration camps were set up before the war, granted they weren't killing them yet just doing forced labor. Britain knew what was going on but didn't want to believe it. Europeans knew it was going on when they saw people being moved around en masse in rail cars. The holocaust was the biggest worldwide denial in that the oppressors denied their right to be humans while the civilian Europeans denied their own power to change this, Allies denied any direct action against these camps until liberating those territories or even informing their soldiers what they would find, and worldwide denial of it happening even while the Nuremburg Trials were held. They knew it went on but couldn't even bring themselves to talk about it after the war until people like Wiesel decided to share their stories.

Why are you denying Fox's right to be fallible?

[hairingtons]

But honestly, that's the worst kind of propoganda. He can take his meds and he won't gyrate. He was also jerking around in front of Congress, almost exactly the same way. So Rush had perfect grounds to accuse him of "either forgetting to take his medicine or faking it." I don't get why the media is all like "Shame on you Rush," when the ad in Tennessee formatted in basically the same way, only against a Democrat, was screamed at for racism and brought to court for libel.

It made me fucking sick when i heard that some fucking dickhead politician was accusing M J Fox of overacting his Parkinsons ailments. What an absolute cock sucker. If anything he was probably trying to stop himself. I know from personal experience what it looks like and what the effects are.

If you dont get why what that prick said brings shame on him or whoever he represents then take a freaking look at yourself. Thats the cold hard truth of Parkinsons. For the people who have it and the familys who look after them. The 'jerking' around is how they have to live. Medicine or no medicine, sometimes they just cant help it.

I hope you never have a member of your family suffer from this. But if you did, at least you'd actually know what you're talking about.

[vtmarik]

We didn't wait for anything. He started attacking countries and slautering Jews and we took him out because of what he became.....this is like arguing killing murderers before they actually commit a murder!

Actually, we waited until Japan attacked us to get involved, and even then we didn't discover the concentration camps until the twilight end of the war.

What Parkinsons' information has surfaced since Fox was diagnosed? It was always there. Why is he concerned with it now? Because he has it. Maybe the word "disgraceful" was not the word I should have used. Maybe "convienetly aware" better fits.

Oh, so the fact that he has the disease now invalidates his desire for a cure? I'm still confused on your thought process here.

I believe Jay has invoked Godwin's Law - yet again - and has lost the argument, such as it was, by default. Sorry jay.

Yeah, Jay loses, and his credibility within this thread has gone kaput. Reductio ad Hitlerum.

[strike wolf]

Okay, jay, heres a scenario. If someone has an abortion would you rather see them use that fetus for something good? or would you rather see it thrown in the trash and rot?

Thats like asking if it would have been acceptable for Hitler to kill Jews if he used the bodies to feed starving children around the world?


The answer is a resounding NO.

Jay your logic is twisted. Well it's bad to allow abortions so they can't be used for anything good while they're legal? Yes explore alternative ways to get stem cells but as long as they are letting people get abortions why not see something come out of it?

[heavycola]

Jay your logic is twisted.

Nominated for understatement of the year (in the "generous use of the word 'logic'" category)