America didn't land on the moon

[Pedronicus]

Very interesting that NASA's Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter can take a picture of the Phoenix Lander... It is 15 feet wide with the solar panels out.

New image as seen from above by NASA's Mars Reconnaissance Orbiter. The blue looking feature in the upper-center part of the picture is the Phoenix Lander...two the circular parts flanking the center mass are the deployed solar panels.

The two impact depressions located in the center of the image is where the heat shield, after being jettisoned, impacted and bounced.

And the parachute and attachment is located at the bottom of the image.

Click image to enlarge.

--Andy

Stuff allegedly left on the moon after America landed on the moon (cough, cough)....
6 x Lunar landing modules
Dimensions
Height: 20.9 ft 6.37 m
Diameter: 14 ft 4.27 m
Landing gear span: 29.75 ft 9.07 m
Volume: 235 ft³ 6.65 m³

3 x Lunar Roving Vehicles (Moon Buggy) : The frame was 10 feet (3 m) long with a wheelbase of 7.5 feet (2.3 m).

No photos to date of these items, plus the flags, footprints and other stuff left behind.....

If America can photo the surface of Mars in a good enough quality to pick out a 15 foot wide lander, it can't hard to launch a high resolution satellite to orbit the moon and take some photos to prove the landings once and for all.

[InkL0sed]

I think NASA has better things to do... you can see the moon with a good pair of binoculars

PS. How do you know there aren't any photos to date? I won't check myself, but I'm willing to bet there actually are pictures.

[Pedronicus]

If anyone had photographed a landing zone with evidence of the landings, the photos would be world famous.
We would all know about them & you wouldn't have to look for them on the internet.

[InkL0sed]

I don't agree. I've never heard of these objects left behind on the moon.

[ParadiceCity9]

Well then prove there aren't any pictures.

[Snorri1234]

I think NASA has better things to do... you can see the moon with a good pair of binoculars

PS. How do you know there aren't any photos to date? I won't check myself, but I'm willing to bet there actually are pictures.

I'm all for sensible and reasonable discussion, but it's obvious the moonlanding was faked.

[Pedronicus]

I don't agree. I've never heard of these objects left behind on the moon.

Use your brain to figure it out. They aren't going to try and leave the surface of the moon with any additional weight.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:LEM-linedrawing.png

[Dancing Mustard]

Here is what we think of people who don't believe in the moon landings.

Yeah. Put that in your telescope and smoke it.

[Anarkistsdream]

Evidence 1:
http://www.braeunig.us/space/hoax.htm


Evidence 2:
In the few hours that Aldrin and Armstrong were on the Moon, there was little time to set up scientific experiments, but a small package (the EASEP, or Early Apollo Scientific Experiments Package) was deployed. Aldrin is shown here setting up the Passive Seismic Experiments Package. Back to the left is the Laser Ranging Retro-Reflector. More extensive scientific studies were done on later Apollo missions.

This was actually used for several months to garner different info after the astronauts had already come back...

Evidence 3: This was taken on the day the astronauts landed, taken by the astronauts.

Click image to enlarge.

Evidence 4:
The astronauts returned to the Lunar Module after 2 hours and 32 minutes on the surface (2:15 for Aldrin) and took this picture. The footprints of the astronauts and the lunar surface television camera can be seen. The flag had been difficult to set up, and was actually knocked over when the LM took off from the Moon 21 hours after landing.

Click image to enlarge.

Evidence 5: Another pic taken that day... How else could it have been taken unless they were right above the moon?





People have very weak arguments against the moon landing... They quote shadows, which are reflected differently due to the lack of atmosphere.

They quote the flag waving. Well, as we all know, the flag WOULD look like it's waving, as it would stay in the EXACT position that it was put in, until acted on by an outside force.

[Anarkistsdream]

I don't agree. I've never heard of these objects left behind on the moon.

Use your brain to figure it out. They aren't going to try and leave the surface of the moon with any additional weight.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:LEM-linedrawing.png

This is an ignorant statement. The moons gravity would allow them to take off by merely PUSHING the craft off the planet... Of COURSE they could carry other shit. WTF are you croaking about?

[Snorri1234]

I have picture too!

[jonesthecurl]

I don't agree. I've never heard of these objects left behind on the moon.

Use your brain to figure it out. They aren't going to try and leave the surface of the moon with any additional weight.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:LEM-linedrawing.png

This is an ignorant statement. The moons gravity would allow them to take off by merely PUSHING the craft off the planet... Of COURSE they could carry other shit. WTF are you croaking about?

Escape velocity from the moon is 1 1/2 miles per second. Far less than the 7 miles a second for Earth, but still enough that you don't want to carry anything you don't have to.
Especially when the fuel you use to lift off has first to be transported there.

On the question of the flag, there was a motor attached to it to make it wave. This was felt to be necessary because they wanted it to wave.

I and anyone else who was following the Apollo progam KNew the flag would wave long before they landed - it was the object of a certain amount of amusement - "typical yanks, have to wave the flag..."

It was even referred to in a play (Habeus Corpus by Alan Bennett )- "Somewhere in the singing silence of space, a tin flag flutters."


The whole world watched the Apollo missions. The signals were coming from the moon, that's why the receivers were pointed at it. Go watch the movie "The Dish", which tells of the Australian radio telescope which had to be brought into play because the US was facing away from the moon at a vital point.

[Pedronicus]

I'm not going to be drawn into the fluttering flag, shadows in the photos, etc. All I'm saying is that in space flight, everything is weighed down to the last gramme, to calculate fuel required to get there and back. Engineering is all about making something as light as possible to do the job.
All unnecessary items will be left behind.
These items are still going to be on the surface of the moon and would be very easy to photograph based on the image that Andy posted showing the phoenix lander, heat shield and parachute.

Photographs of the remaining items of moon landings would be world famous.

NASA would know where the landings are, just as they knew where Phoenix landed.
It's not like trying to get a photo of a giant squid swimming in the deep ocean.
These things are static and their location would be known.

[suggs]

So. 1969. Pretty much the height of the cold war.
Russia has advanced space technology.

Tell me this Pedronicus: if the moon landings were fake, don't you think the Russians would have shouted as loudly as they could "GUYS, ITS FAKED!".

What a colossal public relations victory that would have been -it might even have destroyed the USA's global credibility, leaving the USSR as the victors of the war.

If the landings were faked, do ya think the Russians would have just kept quiet, YOU BLITHERING IDIOT!

"Oh, but Suggs, the Russians didn't know either, they were fooled by the USA's hi tech Hollywood basement video shoot."

Quite seriously, you are a fucking idiot. Bring on a forum ban or something, cos I am tired of dealing with kid gloves with FUCKING PRICKS LIKE YOU WHO SHOW NO INTELLIGENCE, NO FEEL FOR HUMANITY, NO RESPECT FOR WHAT THOSE BRAVE, BRAVE ASTRONAUTS DID.

f*ck OFF.
f*ck OFF.
f*ck OFF.

All the best!
Suggs.

[Pedronicus]

The whole world watched the Apollo missions. The signals were coming from the moon, that's why the receivers were pointed at it. Go watch the movie "The Dish", which tells of the Australian radio telescope which had to be brought into play because the US was facing away from the moon at a vital point.

It would be a lot easier to deploy from the orbiter, a transmitter on the surface of the moon to relay back to earth, all the pre recorded images. Of course America is going to be facing the wrong way for 12 hours. But please don't tell me that if you have some great minds that can actually get a giant rocket to fly, they wouldn't be able concoct a real enough story, to kid most of the population of the planet.

Making a believable story is a lot easier than actually landing on the moon, escaping the moons gravity, linking up with the Apollo Command/Service Module and getting 3 guys back home alive.
All whilst using computers with less computing capacity than a modern BMW...

[Dancing Mustard]

NASA would know where the landings are, just as they knew where Phoenix landed. ...
These things are static and their location would be known.

So just because one method of evidencing the moon-landings hasn't been conducted, it makes all other evidence invalid?

Sorry, but that doesn't wash. These photos would just be another nail in your conspiracy-theory's coffin. But their absence doesn't of itself prove your case, for that you need evidence of your own.

For you to actually prove your original proposition you need some evidence of your proposition, not just the absence of one possible piece of evidence on the part of the opposition (because we have plenty of other evidence that the moon landings happened). Otherwise this is just another "There was no plane hit teh pentagonz cos there is no picture of teh precise second dat teh plane was hitting itz lolololololol" argument.

Conclusion: We accept there's no pic of the moon landing site taken from earth. But you still have a whole lot of legwork to do to prove your point. Either get on with that, or this thread has served its purpose.

[Frigidus]

NASA would know where the landings are, just as they knew where Phoenix landed. ...
These things are static and their location would be known.

So just because one method of evidencing the moon-landings hasn't been conducted, it makes all other evidence invalid?

Sorry, but that doesn't wash. These photos would just be another nail in your conspiracy-theory's coffin. But their absence doesn't of itself prove your case.

For you to actually prove your original proposition you need some evidence of your own, not just an absence of one possible piece of evidence on the part of the opposition. Otherwise this is just another "There was no plane hit teh pentagonz cos there is no picture of teh precise second dat teh plane was hitting itz lolololololol" argument.

We accept there's no pic of the moon landing site taken from earth. But you still have a whole lot of legwork to do to prove your point. Either get on with that, or this thread has served its purpose.

I don't get it, people demand photographic evidence of all this stuff that almost certainly happened, and yet most of them believe in God. Where's the fucking logic?!

[Pedronicus]

Suggs - All I want is some photographic proof (from a satellite or hubble) of the stuff they left behind. It's going to be fairly large. Then I'll shut up.

I never disbelieved that America landed on the moon, but you would think that by now some images would of surfaced from other moon mapping missions.

It's not just NASA in space now. JAXA is up there. I would believe another countries views over an obviously biased NASA mission.


Lunar Explorations

On September 14, 2007, JAXA succeeded in launching lunar orbit explorer "Kaguya", also known as SELENE (costing 55 billion yen including launch vehicle), the largest such mission since the Apollo program, on an H-2A rocket. Its mission is to gather data on the moon's origin and evolution. It entered into a lunar orbit on October 4.[6] [7]

[suggs]

Tell me why the Russians kept silent.

[ParadiceCity9]

I don't get it, people demand photographic evidence of all this stuff that almost certainly happened, and yet most of them believe in God. Where's the fucking logic?!

So true...

[Pedronicus]

Tell me why the Russians kept silent.

No idea, but Japan would love to show the world images of a moon buggy or the descent stage part of the lunar module to add credibility to their own moon mapping mission.

I'm not asking for too much evidence am I?

[ParadiceCity9]

Click image to enlarge.

^^ From Apollo 11

[Pedronicus]

I don't get it, people demand photographic evidence of all this stuff that almost certainly happened, and yet most of them believe in God. Where's the fucking logic?!

I don't believe in god if that helps to clarify anything.

[suggs]

Give me some evidence of why the Russians didn't seize their best opportunity to win the cold war, and I'll listen.

[Pedronicus]

Click image to enlarge.

^^ From Apollo 11

You are giving NASA evidence in a case against NASA? That's really going to stand up in a court of law isn't it?