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The TOP 12 Players under 40

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Postby DiM on Sun Jan 06, 2008 11:36 pm

Blitzaholic wrote:
DiM wrote:again i'm gonna question the usefulness of such tops based on win percentage.

in blitz's top5 we have top 5 team players and those are chosen besed on the fact that they have over 70% wins. it's absurd. if i play nothing but 1v1 games vs new recruits i'm gonna have a high percentage without playing a single team game.

same deal here. what's up with the 40%, 30%??
does that mean people with low% are singles players?

again a person that plays nothing but 1v1 will certainly have more than those percentages yet he won't enter the top because the criteria chosen here is absurd.

i agree determining good singles or doubles players is pretty hard if not impossible until lack decides to put separate tables but until then i'd say you should either do some real research or stop doing these tops. they are useless.

best example jr24. over 1400 points gained in 1v1 freestyle games with a win%of ~ 90 is considered one of the best team players (i don't doubt he is a very good team player) but his score is greatly boosted by singles games and same goes for his win%.

if i start tomorrow and play 1v1 games and get a score high enough will i enter the top team players despite having very few team games??



well, hmmm, you got a point here DiM, however, a vast majority had those winning rates way before 1 on 1's were even added to this site, with the exception probably of jr, you may be right there, cause his winning percentage was under 70% 4 to 5 months ago ( i think he had 64 to 67%) he played a monster number of games 1 on 1 and brought that up a point here and there was boosted over time, i saw it slowly creep up too, but he also played a monster number of team games too, so hard to tell, he has over 6000 games, lol



but for the most part it works, with some exceptions, but i guess there is exception to most things.


actually those tops with those percentages would work only if you want to include 5-6 player games. because let's say a good guy that plays 3-4 player standard games will surely get more than 40%

playing singles in 3 or 4 players can easily get you to 50% and that automatically puts you out of the top. so if a guy gets 5000 points by playing 3-4 player games he won't be considered one of the best singles players despite actually being THE best.

again it's not about small exceptions. there are a lot of singles players that have bigger win% and thus are excluded. look i have 54% and i will never be in that top because of my win% despite having a vast majority of singles games (over 80%). i'm not saying i should be there because there are other singles players much better than me. i just used myself as an example because i know my stats
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Postby Blitzaholic on Mon Jan 07, 2008 12:16 am

yes, well maybe robin could change it to 6 player standard, most of them play 6 player standard anyways, now 7 and 8, i am in a few of them myself.
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Postby Robinette on Mon Jan 07, 2008 1:11 am

WoW DiM, RelaX...

It's just a list...


Seems you'd be upset if there was a list of the top 12 players from, lets say, Japan... afterall, most people would have no chance of being on that list because they don't live in Japan... but what's the harm, it's just a list...

So what does it matter what this list represents, beyond identifying the highest rank losers on this site... yes, losers... these players lose more games than any other high rankers because of the games they choose to play... but what's the harm, it's just a list...

And if you're all bent because you feel it represents the best singles players you should look at the list again. No, it is simply a list of the 12 highest scores below 40%, then below 35%, and finally the few that are below 30%... well clearly people who play a lot of triples or a lot of games with few players will realize a higher win % and not be included... but what's the harm, it's just a list...

So if it means enough to you, you could always start a ton of 6,7, or 8 player singles games... heck, may as well make them terminator, and that way your score would remain somewhat steady but your win % would drop like a rock... but that would be pretty silly from my point of view... but go ahead if you wanted to... what's the harm, it's just a list...

If this still has your feathers ruffled, then make your own list... here, I'll try to help you... Here is a list of the top 5 players with a 54% win rate:
3 Warsteiner 3753 1984 1067 (54%)
43 Lord Nuke 2706 129 70 (54%)
44 DiM 2705 486 264 (54%)
140 Ros 2345 422 227 (54%)
180 jalen45 2264 408 220 (54%)

oh damn... you've got your work cut out for you to be at the top of that list... well, maybe you'll want to change it to the top 5 from Romania, afterall what's the harm, it's just a list...

Now go play some games, or design some maps... do anything but complain about this... afterall it's just a list...
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Postby AAFitz on Mon Jan 07, 2008 1:13 am

Robinette wrote:WoW DiM, RelaX...

It's just a list...


Seems you'd be upset if there was a list of the top 12 players from, lets say, Japan... afterall, most people would have no chance of being on that list because they don't live in Japan... but what's the harm, it's just a list...

So what does it matter what this list represents, beyond identifying the highest rank losers on this site... yes, losers... these players lose more games than any other high rankers because of the games they choose to play... but what's the harm, it's just a list...

And if you're all bent because you feel it represents the best singles players you should look at the list again. No, it is simply a list of the 12 highest scores below 40%, then below 35%, and finally the few that are below 30%... well clearly people who play a lot of triples or a lot of games with few players will realize a higher win % and not be included... but what's the harm, it's just a list...

So if it means enough to you, you could always start a ton of 6,7, or 8 player singles games... heck, may as well make them terminator, and that way your score would remain somewhat steady but your win % would drop like a rock... but that would be pretty silly from my point of view... but go ahead if you wanted to... what's the harm, it's just a list...

If this still has your feathers ruffled, then make your own list... here, I'll try to help you... Here is a list of the top 5 players with a 54% win rate:
3 Warsteiner 3753 1984 1067 (54%)
43 Lord Nuke 2706 129 70 (54%)
44 DiM 2705 486 264 (54%)
140 Ros 2345 422 227 (54%)
180 jalen45 2264 408 220 (54%)

oh damn... you've got your work cut out for you to be at the top of that list... well, maybe you'll want to change it to the top 5 from Romania, afterall what's the harm, it's just a list...

Now go play some games, or design some maps... do anything but complain about this... afterall it's just a list...


i almost made that list... ive had a 54% win rate for almost a year.... it just clicked up one in the last few days..........the horror... make a 55% one :D

dont actually do this
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Postby Robinette on Mon Jan 07, 2008 10:53 am

AAFitz wrote:i almost made that list... ive had a 54% win rate for almost a year.... it just clicked up one in the last few days..........the horror... make a 55% one :D

dont actually do this


lol... fitz, you ARE the #1 player at 55%... woot!

see, all those 54% players need to do is win just a liiiittttlllle bit more and voila! top of the list, baby... lol

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Postby billy07 on Mon Jan 07, 2008 11:04 am

singles list should be 33% and under, not 40%
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Postby a2zsteve on Mon Jan 07, 2008 11:12 am

quick put me on the list before i lose to many points......lol


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Postby DiM on Mon Jan 07, 2008 11:25 am

Robinette wrote:WoW DiM, RelaX...

It's just a list...


Seems you'd be upset if there was a list of the top 12 players from, lets say, Japan... afterall, most people would have no chance of being on that list because they don't live in Japan... but what's the harm, it's just a list...

So what does it matter what this list represents, beyond identifying the highest rank losers on this site... yes, losers... these players lose more games than any other high rankers because of the games they choose to play... but what's the harm, it's just a list...

And if you're all bent because you feel it represents the best singles players you should look at the list again. No, it is simply a list of the 12 highest scores below 40%, then below 35%, and finally the few that are below 30%... well clearly people who play a lot of triples or a lot of games with few players will realize a higher win % and not be included... but what's the harm, it's just a list...

So if it means enough to you, you could always start a ton of 6,7, or 8 player singles games... heck, may as well make them terminator, and that way your score would remain somewhat steady but your win % would drop like a rock... but that would be pretty silly from my point of view... but go ahead if you wanted to... what's the harm, it's just a list...

If this still has your feathers ruffled, then make your own list... here, I'll try to help you... Here is a list of the top 5 players with a 54% win rate:
3 Warsteiner 3753 1984 1067 (54%)
43 Lord Nuke 2706 129 70 (54%)
44 DiM 2705 486 264 (54%)
140 Ros 2345 422 227 (54%)
180 jalen45 2264 408 220 (54%)

oh damn... you've got your work cut out for you to be at the top of that list... well, maybe you'll want to change it to the top 5 from Romania, afterall what's the harm, it's just a list...

Now go play some games, or design some maps... do anything but complain about this... afterall it's just a list...


i love the stats you guys keep they're really nice and for the most part i really enjoy reading them but i'm disturbed that some stats are false.

it it was a list of top players from japan then it would be fine because that's a clear criteria that gets you on that list. no confusion about it and no misinterpretation.

that's my problem misinterpretation. in blitz thread it's "top team players (above 70%)" and as i said in previous posts a singles player can easily get there which makes the list kinda weird.

same thing here. you say top players under 40% but you mean top singles. don't argue cause you know you do especially since on the first post it says loud and clear with big red fonts that this is the NEW TOP SINGLES LIST.
well a doubs team that plays 8p games will get on that list.
a doubs team that plays same ranks or above in 8p games and gets a winning average of 40% will make lots of points and qualify for that top. which is bad since it's purpose is to separate singles players.

i have another idea which will gather more accurate results but it will also include more work.

check games history of the top players.

for example Genghis Khan CA.
499 games completed
he has 312 team games (62.6%) and 187 singles(37.4%)
he is a mixed player so not good for any of the tops.

we go to another one.
Kiron
195 games completed
he has 5 team games (2.6%) and 190 singles(97.4%).
it's clear he's a singles player and a damn good one since over 90% of his singles games are 5 or 6 players.
but his win% is 45% which makes him not qualify for the best singles players top.


it would take maximum half an hour to search the top 50 players and look at what they play. and i even doubt you would need to go all the way to 50.
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