Conquer Club

The Federal Government is now looking into imposing its own tax on the deadly cigarette smoking cult. I hate higher taxes, but in this instance, since it is for the greater good of the populace, I would support a greater tax.

First off, if we tax the living shit out of cigarettes, it will be harder to obtain them, therefore, our kids are less likely to smoke.

Second, A Higher SMoke's Luxury Tax could be used to counter the incredible amounts of money that is wasted in the health care sector to treat smoking related diseases and help fund children health care programs.

Third, if the price of cigarettes becomes so high, that no one but the filthy rich can offord them...then we can kill off the rich elite and take their money!

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071110/ap_ ... syQFkE1vAI

Amazing how much these yuppies love new rules and regulations, and the rationaliztions to justify such are showcases for flatulent hypocrisy.


Honibaz

Well its incredibly addictive, I'm all for it.

b.k. barunt wrote:Amazing how much these yuppies love new rules and regulations, and the rationalizations to justify such are showcases for flatulent hypocrisy.


Honibaz

Edited for your benefit.

unriggable wrote:Well its incredibly addictive, I'm all for it.

Myself, I wouldn't even care if they banned cigarettes from the market...but then we would just run into the slippery slope of the Black Market.

I wouldn't care if they banned cigarettes, but I wouldn't support it (if that makes sense), so I guess I really do care if they ban cigarette smoking...geesh!

I support the higher cigarette taxes but I do not support making cigarettes totally illegal, because that will just cause the same problems that the Drug War has caused.

I have quit drinking and using drugs for at least three years now, and I don't miss any of it. But I do not support Prohibition, as people will always seek out their vices, even if it brings harm to the community. So, I believe in legalization, but with high taxes, strong governmental regulations, and increased education.

I definitely support any type of medicinal marijuana bill, but it is up to the legislators to form the bill so as it would not be abused...as I think it is in other states.

Aaaaah, currently the only "no" vote. I'm against this tax for a few reasons. The states (at least NY) has been grossly overtaxing cigarettes for years. While alcohol never seems to get the same amount of attention. (I can run to the store and by almost 3 bottles of MadDog 20/20 for the price of 1 pack of cigarettes , thanks to the TAXES.

I have no ill will against the rich. I have never felt the desire to kill them off, by letting them be the only ones that can afford to smoke.

The "war on tobacco" has gone far enough. With all the legislation making it harder and harder to "light up" a total ban on smoking seems to be looming in the future. I might come off a little bias, as I am a smoker.... but even if I wasn't I believe in the "right" of people to do so.

jay_a2j wrote:Aaaaah, currently the only "no" vote. I'm against this tax for a few reasons. The states (at least NY) has been grossly overtaxing cigarettes for years. While alcohol never seems to get the same amount of attention. (I can run to the store and by almost 3 bottles of MadDog 20/20 for the price of 1 pack of cigarettes , thanks to the TAXES.

I have no ill will against the rich. I have never felt the desire to kill them off, by letting them be the only ones that can afford to smoke.

The "war on tobacco" has gone far enough. With all the legislation making it harder and harder to "light up" a total ban on smoking seems to be looming in the future. I might come off a little bias, as I am a smoker.... but even if I wasn't I believe in the "right" of people to do so.

I believe in your right to cough up a lung, but what about the health care to pay for that lung?

I am usually not in favor of any increase in taxes, but an increased tax on cigarette smoking would be a breath of fresh air for all Americans in general.

And, no, I do not condone killing rich people...that was just a joke.

jay_a2j wrote:Aaaaah, currently the only "no" vote. I'm against this tax for a few reasons. The states (at least NY) has been grossly overtaxing cigarettes for years. While alcohol never seems to get the same amount of attention. (I can run to the store and by almost 3 bottles of MadDog 20/20 for the price of 1 pack of cigarettes , thanks to the TAXES.

I have no ill will against the rich. I have never felt the desire to kill them off, by letting them be the only ones that can afford to smoke.

The "war on tobacco" has gone far enough. With all the legislation making it harder and harder to "light up" a total ban on smoking seems to be looming in the future. I might come off a little bias, as I am a smoker.... but even if I wasn't I believe in the "right" of people to do so.

Wow....
I agree with Jay.

Also, the healtcare issue is ridiculous. Should we also tax junkfood and coffee more? How about we charge people more for their healthcare if they live in the city? Those exhaust fumes can't be good for their health, and living in the city probably means you have a higher chance of getting run over. Alcohol is generally worse for you than smoking, and it causes accidents much more. Why not put ridicously high taxes on alcohol then?

Also, the best way to discourage smoking among kids is not making it a taboo issue. Educate kids on it and try to show that smoking isn't cool. Making it a taboo doesn't seem to make a difference, look at marijuana, which almost everyone has tried sometime. You can actually by it (almost) totally legal here, but because nobody thinks it's cool anymore the amount of people who use it becomes less every year.

Do you guys have a smoking ban for public places these days?

If yes, I wouldn't see the point in the tax.

It's not news that smoking is bad for your wealth.

Sin taxes suck. The price of cigarettes is mostly tax already.

Flatulent Hypocracy Rools and politicians drool over any new tax.

oVo wrote:Sin taxes suck. The price of cigarettes is mostly tax already.

Flatulent Hypocracy Rools and politicians drool over any new tax.

yes I agree, but Im not sure its that cut and dried. heres more to consider.


1 I want the citizens to get so pissed off at this government that they finally open their eyes, and this tax will help the ball rolling. more and more people are seeing the effects of a ever controlling anti-freedom government that our forfathers faught and died to stop.

2 The governments motive here is to really get people on parmacuticales instead of Gods plant, just as pot. Drugs cost more and just as habit forming and the controll issue is exactly what this government wants

3 It will cause a larger black market, like pot, and this is not good

4 the government really needs people to die from smoking. I read an article 15 years ago from allan greenspan that said if the 480,000+ people that die from cancer from smoking didnt die off each year the social security system would go bust, so I think on the one hand they want more money but they dont really want to save lives for those who dont work anymore (lung cancer usually takes 30-40 years and the worker is already out of the IRS system, work wise anyway.

if we follow gip's logic (only time he will be mentioned in same sentence as "logic"), we also have to tax the shit out of anything unhealthy. therefore, we need to tax almost all fast food until annihilation. same for most chips and snacks.

here's the thing with smoking: no matter what you think of it, you have to admit it's fucking cool

leave smokers alone

or legalize tweed, i would accept the tradeoff

jay_a2j wrote:Aaaaah, currently the only "no" vote. I'm against this tax for a few reasons. The states (at least NY) has been grossly overtaxing cigarettes for years. While alcohol never seems to get the same amount of attention. (I can run to the store and by almost 3 bottles of MadDog 20/20 for the price of 1 pack of cigarettes , thanks to the TAXES.

I have no ill will against the rich. I have never felt the desire to kill them off, by letting them be the only ones that can afford to smoke.

The "war on tobacco" has gone far enough. With all the legislation making it harder and harder to "light up" a total ban on smoking seems to be looming in the future. I might come off a little bias, as I am a smoker.... but even if I wasn't I believe in the "right" of people to do so.

do you also believe in the "right" of people to do drugs, be homosexual, not believe your fairy tales etc etc?

Nephilim wrote:or legalize tweed, i would accept the tradeoff

I didn't know tweed was illegal?

The1exile wrote:

Nephilim wrote:or legalize tweed, i would accept the tradeoff

I didn't know tweed was illegal?

america doesn't feel the full effects of tweed legalization... *shudders*

Nephilim wrote:if we follow gip's logic (only time he will be mentioned in same sentence as "logic"), we also have to tax the shit out of anything unhealthy. therefore, we need to tax almost all fast food until annihilation. same for most chips and snacks.

here's the thing with smoking: no matter what you think of it, you have to admit it's fucking cool

leave smokers alone

or legalize tweed, i would accept the tradeoff

Well, the food industry needs to be held accountable for some health issues as well...even more so than cigarettes, because anybody can walk into a store and buy a bag of chips.

If the tobacco industry was held accountable for its health issues then the fast and junk food industry should follow suit. You already know something is up by almost all fast food chains offering Salads on their menus now...that might be the one thing that might save them from frivilent law suits.

When I was a kid, my parents took us to MickyD's quite a bit, and you become programmed by that. Funny Clown + FatFood = Good!

I donot see warnings on any of the food products that contain Hydrogenated oils...that could play a factor in law suits. Even the tobacco industry put warning labels on their DeathSticks!

Hydrogentated oils do not break down like regular oils, therefore, these manufactured oil preservitives gather in atteries and is one of the main reasons for heart disease. A cardiologist knows exactly what he is going to find when he opens you up...and he will tell you hydrogenated oils.

So if not a tax, then what? Why should cigarettes be so cheap that it doesn't matter to you to quit smoking anymore?

My personal belief is that each pack of cigarettes should cost about $30 American. That would just cut to the chase, as the government has an incremental tax scheme, in which it raises the price of cigarettes little by little every so often, until they obtain a 100% non-smoking rate. So if they just taxed you as much as what their staticians figure would be the amount to obtain about 100% non-smoking rate, that would come to about $30 a pack American.

... Personal accountability and personal responsibility.... seems to be vanishing. Anybody who doesn't know chips and fast food will make you fat, cigarettes can kill you, etc... has been living on the moon for the last 50 years.

... Any fool who smokes, or stuffs their face with fat deserves what he or she gets. Government has nothing to do with it.

... Liberty and Safety of citizens are the responsibility of government. Anything else is an affront.

...

Nobunaga wrote:... Personal accountability and personal responsibility.... seems to be vanishing. Anybody who doesn't know chips and fast food will make you fat, cigarettes can kill you, etc... has been living on the moon for the last 50 years.

... Any fool who smokes, or stuffs their face with fat deserves what he or she gets. Government has nothing to do with it.

... Liberty and Safety of citizens are the responsibility of government. Anything else is an affront.

...

Well, there are a lot of people that don't know that hydrogenated oils can cause heart disease...where are the warnings on the foods with these oils?

DaGip wrote:

Nobunaga wrote:... Personal accountability and personal responsibility.... seems to be vanishing. Anybody who doesn't know chips and fast food will make you fat, cigarettes can kill you, etc... has been living on the moon for the last 50 years.

... Any fool who smokes, or stuffs their face with fat deserves what he or she gets. Government has nothing to do with it.

... Liberty and Safety of citizens are the responsibility of government. Anything else is an affront.

...

Well, there are a lot of people that don't know that hydrogenated oils can cause heart disease...where are the warnings on the foods with these oils?

... That would fall under "Safety", and so such lables should be put on such products.

... Obviously.

...

Nobunaga wrote:

DaGip wrote:

Nobunaga wrote:... Personal accountability and personal responsibility.... seems to be vanishing. Anybody who doesn't know chips and fast food will make you fat, cigarettes can kill you, etc... has been living on the moon for the last 50 years.

... Any fool who smokes, or stuffs their face with fat deserves what he or she gets. Government has nothing to do with it.

... Liberty and Safety of citizens are the responsibility of government. Anything else is an affront.

...

Well, there are a lot of people that don't know that hydrogenated oils can cause heart disease...where are the warnings on the foods with these oils?

... That would fall under "Safety", and so such lables should be put on such products.

... Obviously.

...

Agreed.

And I don't know about all these extra taxes on Cigarettes...I mean, if we tax the shit out of them, who benefits? As I do not smoke anymore, I could care less about if cigarettes are taxed or not, and if the legislation would convince me of the benefit for the tax, I probably would vote for it despite my more libertarian views. I think everyone should quit smoking, then we wouldn't have to worry about the whole issue.

The other issue at hand is the anti-smoking laws in public places. I mean, does a BAR constitute as a PUBLIC place? Isn't a BAR a private establishment? And shouldn't the owner decide what he or she allows to happen in his or her establishment?

Smoking in Public is nasty and I hate seeing cigarette butts all over the place. I mean can we increase the fines for smoker's littering and smoking in places they are not supposed to?

But, I do not think the laws should be able to invade PRIVATE establishments and their business. If someone wants a NON-smoking establishment, then they should have one. If they want to have both a non-smoking environment and a designated smoking area...they should have that too. If they only want SMOKERS...then great! Let them just have smokers then.

Maybe overtaxing cigarettes is not the answer either. I will have to seriously think this one through, because taxing cigarettes always comes up on the ballot. And for the life of me, I do not see the harm in it, since you shouldn't be smoking anyway! (Love, Mom... )

i see nothing wrong with a higher tax on cigs, it's only a matter of time before they make them illegal anyways... might as well make it harder to buy them too.... in fact lets just stop all tabaco plantations completely, cause if the war on mariuana has taught us one thing it's that we know how to stop the production and sale of somthing that's addictive and supposedly bad for you...........

And this is what happens to you when you smoke too much!






































































Quitting smoking now greatly reduces your risk of Ugly Dogginess!

Once had a discussion with a friend - would you trade up the legalisation of marijuana if it meant it was taxed and therefore cost more money.

Still don't really know what I'd want. At the moment I haven't been caught with it, so I guess I'd say no, but then he came up with point that it would be easier to get, just walk down to the shop. That would be a lot easier (and safer, especially if you don't have a reliable friendly source and have some scum bag dealing it) - either way, it's stupid that it is illegal while ciggarettes and alcohol are legal. The cotton Industry helped outlaw marijuana in the early 20th century because hemp was threatening to outsell cotton for material. Bastards.

But in the mean time, more tax on Petrol. That shit should be taxed so high so that noone uses it

radiojake wrote:Once had a discussion with a friend - would you trade up the legalisation of marijuana if it meant it was taxed and therefore cost more money.

Still don't really know what I'd want. At the moment I haven't been caught with it, so I guess I'd say no, but then he came up with point that it would be easier to get, just walk down to the shop. That would be a lot easier (and safer, especially if you don't have a reliable friendly source and have some scum bag dealing it) - either way, it's stupid that it is illegal while ciggarettes and alcohol are legal. The cotton Industry helped outlaw marijuana in the early 20th century because hemp was threatening to outsell cotton for material. Bastards.

I doubt it will cost much more money. Because the reason it is expensive now is because it's illegal. Dealers, growers, smugglers all take great risks, which they take out on the buyer. If it was legal you wouldn't need smugglers or dealers, as the people who grow it could sell it directly.
But this has nothing to do with the thread.


Hey, DaGip. I know who benefits with higher taxes. It's the government! Just like with petrol and booze.

Leave smokers alone, I can do whatever the fck I want with my body.

... Politicians crack me up (and piss me off at the same time). You'll hear candidates for public office speaking about high gas prices, usually blaming it on their political advesaries...

... I don't know the current rate, but in March of this year, the federal tax on gasoline was 45.8 cents for every gallon.

... Government is making a fortune with these taxes. . . and while politicians moan about high gas prices, talk of reducing that tax never comes up (that I've seen).

... *ssholes. I paid $3.19 a gallon yesterday. That pissed me off.

...