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13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Tue Jul 18, 2023 11:55 pm
by saxitoxin
Thirteen Keys to the White House has correctly predicted 9 of the last 10 elections ... if at least six statements are FALSE, the incumbent party loses the White House. So far, Biden has unlocked three of the six keys.

    Midterm gains: After the midterm elections, the incumbent party holds more seats in the U.S. House of Representatives than after the previous midterm elections.
    FALSE

    No primary contest: There is no serious contest for the incumbent party nomination. [the incumbent gets less than 2/3rds of his party's delegates by the convention]
    UNKNOWN

    Incumbent seeking re-election: The incumbent party candidate is the sitting president.
    TRUE

    No third party: There is no significant third party or independent campaign. [a campaign where the third party candidate is expected to get 5%+ of the popular vote]
    UNKNOWN

    Strong short-term economy: The economy is not in recession during the election campaign.
    UNKNOWN

    Strong long-term economy: Real per capita economic growth during the term equals or exceeds mean growth during the previous two terms.
    UNKNOWN

    Major policy change: The incumbent administration effects major changes in national policy.
    TRUE
    (???)

    No social unrest: There is no sustained social unrest during the term.
    UNKNOWN

    No scandal: The incumbent administration is untainted by major scandal.
    UNKNOWN

    No foreign/military failure: The incumbent administration suffers no major failure in foreign or military affairs.
    FALSE
    (Afghanistan withdrawal)

    Major foreign/military success: The incumbent administration achieves a major success in foreign or military affairs.
    UNKNOWN

    Charismatic incumbent: The incumbent party candidate is charismatic or a national hero.
    FALSE

    Uncharismatic challenger: The challenging party candidate is not charismatic or a national hero.
    TRUE

Re: 13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2023 12:02 am
by saxitoxin
I'm seeing these five as the most likely for Biden to unlock; if he gets three of the five he loses, but if he gets two or less of the five he'd win.

Strong short-term economy: The economy is not in recession during the election campaign.


There seems to be a consensus of the U.S. entering a recession during Q1/Q2 of 2024. With the average recession lasting nine months, this would take it through the election.

Strong long-term economy: Real per capita economic growth during the term equals or exceeds mean growth during the previous two terms.


Anything other than an almost-unprecedented spike in growth in 2024 will cause this to be false.

Major foreign/military success: The incumbent administration achieves a major success in foreign or military affairs.


If the situation in Ukraine goes south, Biden will be left without any major foreign policy success. If the Ukes come out on top, he'll get this one.

No scandal: The incumbent administration is untainted by major scandal.


Licht defines this as a scandal that mobilizes criticism of the president from his own party. With the Hur investigation continuing, and the Oversight investigation continuing, this is too soon to tell where it will land. My guess is, however, Biden will probably be safe, but there are too many unknowns to say for certain.

No third party: There is no significant third party or independent campaign. [a campaign where the third party candidate is expected to get 5%+ of the popular vote]


Cornel West will not be a serious contender for 5% of the popular vote, though, Manchin might if he goes No Labels.

Re: 13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2023 9:48 pm
by DirtyDishSoap
What're the 13 keys to pound on your front door?

Re: 13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Fri Jul 21, 2023 5:16 pm
by GaryDenton
(Afghanistan withdrawal)

That was a Trump surrender and they helped the new government takeover.

I am sorry the Right media covered it up and even the corporate media mostly ignored it.
Ukraine and NATO are big Biden wins.
The economy is looking good despite the Fed Reserve trying to cause a recession but I don't know if that holds. Biden's infrastructure spending and trade policies are helping.

There doesn't seem to be a key that the likely opposition nominee is a traitorous crook being tried or in jail with a worse approval rating than the incumbent.

Re: 13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Fri Jul 21, 2023 5:32 pm
by saxitoxin
GaryDenton wrote:(Afghanistan withdrawal)

That was a Trump


Nobody believes that. This is proved by every poll taken: https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/wh ... -it-so-far.

Rightly or wrongly, this has already been etched in stone in the public mind as a Biden loss and can't be rewritten. Facts are irrelevant. Only perception matters.

Re: 13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Fri Jul 21, 2023 6:06 pm
by mookiemcgee
saxitoxin wrote:Uncharismatic challenger: The challenging party candidate is not charismatic or a national hero.
TRUE[/list]


You don't find Trump charismatic anymore?

Re: 13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Fri Jul 21, 2023 6:28 pm
by bigtoughralf

Re: 13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Fri Jul 21, 2023 7:03 pm
by saxitoxin
mookiemcgee wrote:
saxitoxin wrote:Uncharismatic challenger: The challenging party candidate is not charismatic or a national hero.
TRUE[/list]


You don't find Trump charismatic anymore?


I find him very charismatic. But a plurality of people consider Trump (and Biden) unlikable. (https://today.yougov.com/topics/politic ... ?period=3m)

Neither of them are an Obama or Kennedy or Eisenhower or Clinton.

Re: 13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Fri Jul 21, 2023 8:24 pm
by mookiemcgee
saxitoxin wrote:
mookiemcgee wrote:
saxitoxin wrote:Uncharismatic challenger: The challenging party candidate is not charismatic or a national hero.
TRUE[/list]


You don't find Trump charismatic anymore?


I find him very charismatic. But a plurality of people consider Trump (and Biden) unlikable. (https://today.yougov.com/topics/politic ... ?period=3m)

Neither of them are an Obama or Kennedy or Eisenhower or Clinton.


You find Hillary Clinton charismatic? (kidding)

Re: 13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Fri Jul 21, 2023 8:27 pm
by saxitoxin
mookiemcgee wrote:
saxitoxin wrote:
mookiemcgee wrote:
saxitoxin wrote:Uncharismatic challenger: The challenging party candidate is not charismatic or a national hero.
TRUE[/list]


You don't find Trump charismatic anymore?


I find him very charismatic. But a plurality of people consider Trump (and Biden) unlikable. (https://today.yougov.com/topics/politic ... ?period=3m)

Neither of them are an Obama or Kennedy or Eisenhower or Clinton.


You find Hillary Clinton charismatic? (kidding)


Some are ass guys, some are breast guys. I'm a cankle guy. Don't judge me.

Re: 13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Sat Jul 22, 2023 10:38 am
by bigtoughralf
Just because the blue hair non-monogamy crowd don't like Trump doesn't mean he isn't charismatic. The blue and red halves of the US government have about 90% of their votes sewn up at every election, so Trump really only needs to be able to rouse a few million people across the country (which he has done before).

I was just in Morocco and had a taxi driver telling me Biden was a poor president but Trump had been good, because he told the truth. Trump has cut across and presence.

Re: 13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Sat Jul 22, 2023 10:41 am
by bigtoughralf
And he's got the powerful ghost vote:


Re: 13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Sat Jul 22, 2023 9:43 pm
by jimboston
bigtoughralf wrote:I was just in Morocco and had a taxi driver telling me Biden was a poor president but Trump had been good, because he told the truth. Trump has cut across and presence.



Please explain how this is relevant.

It might be relevant to the perception of US policies across the globe.
It’s irrelevant to how our people will decide who to place in the White House.

Re: 13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Sun Jul 23, 2023 6:36 am
by bigtoughralf
jimboston wrote:
bigtoughralf wrote:I was just in Morocco and had a taxi driver telling me Biden was a poor president but Trump had been good, because he told the truth. Trump has cut across and presence.



Please explain how this is relevant.

It might be relevant to the perception of US policies across the globe.


He said policy-wise Trump was just as bad as the other US presidents, but still thought he was better based on personality and presentation.

Let me know if this still isn't making sense to you and I'll see what I can do.

Re: 13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Sun Jul 23, 2023 11:15 am
by Dukasaur
jimboston wrote:
bigtoughralf wrote:I was just in Morocco and had a taxi driver telling me Biden was a poor president but Trump had been good, because he told the truth. Trump has cut across and presence.



Please explain how this is relevant.

It might be relevant to the perception of US policies across the globe.
It’s irrelevant to how our people will decide who to place in the White House.


It's relevant to show just how amazing is Trump's skill at bullshitting people. Despite objective evidence that everything Trump says is a lie, there are millions of people around the world who credit him as a "straight shooter" and believe his bullshit.

Re: 13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Sun Jul 23, 2023 6:41 pm
by GaryDenton
This:

Despite objective evidence that everything Trump says is a lie, there are millions of people around the world who credit him as a "straight shooter" and believe his bullshit.


The more people who can see through his BS the bigger will be his defeat.

Re: 13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Sun Jul 23, 2023 6:49 pm
by jimboston
Do you all think how people view Trump in Morocco is material in any way to a Trump voter?

Re: 13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Sun Jul 23, 2023 7:35 pm
by saxitoxin
bigtoughralf wrote:And he's got the powerful ghost vote:



you would love to be that ghost, admit it

Re: 13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2023 7:13 am
by GaryDenton
Americans believe Biden did the right thing in withdrawing U.S. troops from Afghanistan.

Americans are as likely to view the whole 20-year experience in that country as a mistake as to say it was not, while recent polling shows the majority say involvement there was not worth it. But the extremely rapid movement of the Taliban to wrest back control of the country has left Americans with the perception that the withdrawal has not been handled well. Biden is given low marks for his handling of the situation - Aug 2021

What the media, especially conservative media, has refused to cover - Trump Struck a Deal on Feb. 29, 2020 — U.S. and Taliban sign an agreement that sets the terms for a U.S. withdrawal from Afghanistan by May 1 2021. Biden could only delay this.

What has been framed by the media is that Biden gets low marks for how poorly the withdrawal was executed.

However, this is way down on the list of matters affecting the election.

Anytime it comes up all Democrats need to do is repeat that Trump surrendered to the Taliban and released the prisoners who took over. In fact, the Taliban was supposed to take over even more rapidly. Eventually, the truth will sink in.

Re: 13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2023 7:22 am
by GaryDenton
The easiest take on the election now is that despite everything Trump will be the GOP candidate.
A Wall Street Journal poll shows Biden is backed by a wide margin of voters who disapprove of both the Biden and Trump presidencies. Biden is viewed as the better of the choices.

Re: 13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2023 10:13 am
by bigtoughralf
GaryDenton wrote:A Wall Street Journal poll shows Biden is backed by a wide margin of voters who disapprove of both the Biden and Trump presidencies.


Democracy in action.

Re: 13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2023 11:53 am
by saxitoxin
    Gary's internal monologue: "let's see is this works on them"
Gary wrote:(Afghanistan withdrawal) That was a Trump surrender


    Gary's internal monologue: "hmmm ... that didn't work; let's try the other version"

Gary wrote:Biden did the right thing in withdrawing U.S. troops from Afghanistan.

Re: 13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2023 11:55 am
by saxitoxin
GaryDenton wrote:A Wall Street Journal poll shows Biden is backed by a wide margin of voters who disapprove of both the Biden and Trump presidencies. Biden is viewed as the better of the choices.


Does this poll exist anywhere we can see it? Or just in your head?

Re: 13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2023 12:02 pm
by saxitoxin
GaryDenton wrote:In fact, the Taliban was supposed to take over even more rapidly.


So Biden lied then?

Biden eight days before the fall of Kabul --

    Q: "Will the Taliban takeover?"
    Old Joe: "NO! You have the Afghan troops ... 300,000, well equipped. And an air force. Against something like 75,000 Taliban... I trust the ability of the Afghan military. "



    Q: "Do you see any parallel between this and the withdrawal from Vietnam?"
    Old Joe: "NO! None whatsoever!"

Image

Re: 13 Keys (2024 Election)

PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2023 9:18 pm
by GaryDenton
What should Joe have said, while our ally that Trump had screwed was fighting for its life?
What should he have said?
"Sorry, Trump surrendered and said the Taliban can take over as long as we can withdraw in peace, per his deal. Good luck, you are screwed"
I would have said that, but I am not a long-time moderate politician.