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jimboston wrote:A big reason I started questioning my faith was when as a child I learned Gandhi wasn’t Christian and I asked if he could go to heaven, and my Priest said “NO”.
DoomYoshi wrote:jimboston wrote:A big reason I started questioning my faith was when as a child I learned Gandhi wasn’t Christian and I asked if he could go to heaven, and my Priest said “NO”.
What makes your priest the judge of who goes to heaven? Or, more importantly to our story - what makes you the judge, or your daughter?
riskllama wrote:Koolbak wins this thread.
KoolBak wrote:Mine is the tightest, happiest family I've ever been exposed to.
KoolBak wrote:Can't simply being a good person be a thing without the threat of eternal damnation?
riskllama wrote:Koolbak wins this thread.
DoomYoshi wrote:jimboston wrote:A big reason I started questioning my faith was when as a child I learned Gandhi wasn’t Christian and I asked if he could go to heaven, and my Priest said “NO”.
What makes your priest the judge of who goes to heaven? Or, more importantly to our story - what makes you the judge, or your daughter?
HitRed wrote:The Catholic Church teaches it is the Fullness of Truth but not the sole holder of truth.Protestants still believe in The God of Abraham, The 10 Commandments, Bapism to forgive sins, the Trinity and yes Jesus. Not the Eucharist (some exceptions). Same with Jewish believers, The God of Abraham, The 10 Commandments.
The sad truth is not everyone is going to Heaven.
There are two main thoughts on this.
1) God judges you.
2) You or your heart choose your destination of Heaven or Hell.
mrswdk wrote:DoomYoshi wrote:jimboston wrote:A big reason I started questioning my faith was when as a child I learned Gandhi wasn’t Christian and I asked if he could go to heaven, and my Priest said “NO”.
What makes your priest the judge of who goes to heaven? Or, more importantly to our story - what makes you the judge, or your daughter?
This. 'Heaven' is a concept is specific to the Abrahamic religions (Christianity, Judaism, Islam) which all teach that people can go to heaven even if they are not a follower of that religion.
KoolBak wrote:Interesting read.
I was raised, and am still firmly, agnostic. With no built in religious faith and my love of scientific knowledge of the universe (big fucking place), believing in the whole religion thing is a stretch.
However I chose to go to a private Catholic college. Sister school to Notre Dame. Quality of education plus my GF was going there....lol.
Anyhow, they required everyone to take theology and philosophy full time, all 4 years. I was quite nervous of the theology.
Turns out it was completely objective and covered all major religions known. The priest (father?) That taught the judeo christian portion began his class with "The Bible is a work of fiction and we can't prove Jesus existed". The rest of the class busted a nut while I immediately loved this guy. Comes down to faith. Very interesting 4 years if study. I got straight As. My best friend (still to this day), a devout Catholic born and bred, struggled....lol. All of them had a tough time with the other religions.
Close minded, uptight, tunnel visioned, holier than thou jackwagons for the most part. Sad. Religion sposed to make you a better person? Mine is the tightest, happiest family I've ever been exposed to. Can't simply being a good person be a thing without the threat of eternal damnation?
My youngest son's best friend growing up had to stop being friends as his batshit crazy Mormon parents deemed him not appropriate. Had words with them at the grocery store....that was fun. Poor kid now has no friends and us failing in school. Good job parents.
jimboston wrote:DoomYoshi wrote:jimboston wrote:A big reason I started questioning my faith was when as a child I learned Gandhi wasn’t Christian and I asked if he could go to heaven, and my Priest said “NO”.
What makes your priest the judge of who goes to heaven? Or, more importantly to our story - what makes you the judge, or your daughter?
I don’t presume to be the judge, nor does my daughter.
The Catholic Church Doctrine dictates that you can only go to Heaven Through Jesus... i.e. you must accept Jesus as the Son of God and your Savior.
(I don’t subscribe to this believe... just telling you what the Church says.)
I am the one true way to the Father. I am the gateway to Heaven.
I am the gateway, the key that unlocks Heaven for all that choose to seek the narrow way.
All must come to me in the end. I am the gateway to the Father in Heaven.
I come to bring all to my one Sacred Heart, the true gateway to my Father in Heaven.
I am the way that all must seek. I am the gateway to the Father in Heaven. No one goes to my Father except through the Son.
All must come through me. I am the gateway to the Father.
DoomYoshi wrote:Your comments indicated that you do somewhat believe yourself to be judge.
You said Gandhi not being Christian made you question your faith. I was just following this to mean that you think Gandhi "should be" in heaven. So the question becomes then, do you trust yourself to make that call? Or even better, do you trust the priest to make that call?
DoomYoshi wrote:I don't think it is up for humans to decide the eternal destiny of other humans. However, it is up to you to decide. If you knowingly choose to reject Jesus, then you reject eternal life.
HitRed wrote:All the following include Jesus referring to himself as the gateway.I am the one true way to the Father. I am the gateway to Heaven.
I am the gateway, the key that unlocks Heaven for all that choose to seek the narrow way.
All must come to me in the end. I am the gateway to the Father in Heaven.
I come to bring all to my one Sacred Heart, the true gateway to my Father in Heaven.
I am the way that all must seek. I am the gateway to the Father in Heaven. No one goes to my Father except through the Son.
All must come through me. I am the gateway to the Father.
... and your point?
He’s THE gateway. You gotta go through him. He’s your connection to the Big Guy.
Are you saying that my statement about Catholic Doctrine is wrong?
(Please note that my summary of Catholic Doctrine is just that... a summary... but the essential point is made... you gotta be Christian to go to Heaven. Furthermore note that my own feelings are NOT the same as the summary of Catholic Doctrine that I am writing.)
... also none of you has talked about the evolution of the Church. Are you saying it won’t evolve or will it?
I accept the free will of humans to choose good or bad. I come to lead those willing to follow me willingly.
I would have all with me but I respect the human free will to choose.
There is a Hell and people really do go there of their own free will. I can only warn and tell how to avoid this unimaginable death.
jimboston wrote:DoomYoshi wrote:Your comments indicated that you do somewhat believe yourself to be judge.
You said Gandhi not being Christian made you question your faith. I was just following this to mean that you think Gandhi "should be" in heaven. So the question becomes then, do you trust yourself to make that call? Or even better, do you trust the priest to make that call?
I don’t think I am arbiter or whether or not Gandhi should be in Heaven.
I do think that he was, by nearly universal accounts, a “good” man. A who helped his people achieve independence and freedom from oppression by preaching peaceful methods. That’s a very laudable and Christ-like accomplishment.
More specifically though I DON’T think he’s entrance into Heaven should be determine solely upon the fact that he wasn’t Christian and didn’t believe Jesus was the One True Savior.
“Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven. Many will say to Me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in Your name, cast out demons in Your name, and done many wonders in Your name?’ And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness!’
I disagree that I am dooming myself to Hell because I ‘reject’ Christ. I don’t reject most of what the Bible states as the opinions of Christ and I accept what is stated as his teachings.... that we should (in general) love and be kind to our fellow humans. I just feel God (if there is a God) will give me a pass on disbelieving in Jesus if I am otherwise a mostly good person.
jimboston wrote:The Catholic Church Doctrine dictates that you can only go to Heaven Through Jesus...
mrswdk wrote:jimboston wrote:The Catholic Church Doctrine dictates that you can only go to Heaven Through Jesus...
The head of the Catholic church (the 'Pope') says that you don't have to believe in god to go to heaven:
https://charterforcompassion.org/unders ... -to-heaven
inb4 jim "the pope can't control Catholics and therefore his statements are irrelevant"
Everyone must go through me to reach the Father of all.
HitRed wrote:Jesus on free will to choose
I accept the free will of humans to choose good or bad. I come to lead those willing to follow me willingly.
I would have all with me but I respect the human free will to choose.
There is a Hell and people really do go there of their own free will. I can only warn and tell how to avoid this unimaginable death.
jonesthecurl wrote:HitRed wrote:Jesus on free will to choose
I accept the free will of humans to choose good or bad. I come to lead those willing to follow me willingly.
I would have all with me but I respect the human free will to choose.
There is a Hell and people really do go there of their own free will. I can only warn and tell how to avoid this unimaginable death.
Source?
HitRed wrote:jonesthecurl wrote:HitRed wrote:Jesus on free will to choose
I accept the free will of humans to choose good or bad. I come to lead those willing to follow me willingly.
I would have all with me but I respect the human free will to choose.
There is a Hell and people really do go there of their own free will. I can only warn and tell how to avoid this unimaginable death.
Source?
God
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