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Why is there a fight over a wall?

PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2019 2:39 pm
by armati
It can’t be the money.

America just bought two more aircraft carriers at $7-10 billion each, and if they are like the last one, they will arrive broken and unfixable.

It isn’t just that, $5 or $10 billion for a wall?

Reagan spent $2.5 trillion on a missile defense system and, lo and behold, were one to believe the popular narrative of 9/11, fat and slow airliners hijacked and flown by illiterates with box cutters only narrowly escaped killing up to 40,000 Americans while the Pentagon, with its trillion dollar plus plus plus missile system was helpless.


Oh wait, one of the planes actually hit the Pentagon, the most defended building on the planet.

So, why can’t Trump have a wall?

Re: Why is there a fight over a wall?

PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2019 4:36 pm
by tzor
Because Trump.

Re: Why is there a fight over a wall?

PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2019 6:09 pm
by Symmetry
armati wrote:were one to believe the popular narrative of 9/11, fat and slow airliners hijacked and flown by illiterates with box cutters only narrowly escaped killing up to 40,000 Americans while the Pentagon, with its trillion dollar plus plus plus missile system was helpless


I take it you have your own unique take on 9/11?

Re: Why is there a fight over a wall?

PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2019 8:38 pm
by armati
The 9/11 Building Collapse | Richard Gage

https://youtu.be/nu2QqxpYcvA

Re: Why is there a fight over a wall?

PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2019 10:52 pm
by mookiemcgee
because, broken promises armati. The american people were promised a free wall paid for by mexico. First of all, 5 billion is for 1 year of wall building (phase 1), the real ask here is 25 billion or more over several years. Why should they be ok with spending 25 billion over a decade on something that was promised as free? If a pres candidate offered us free aircraft carriers paid for by russia and then we got a bill for 8 billion and a broken and expensive floating paperweight, americans would be upset about that too.

Re: Why is there a fight over a wall?

PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 5:17 am
by Bernie Sanders
Trump will get his wall, once he gets his @ss thrown in prison.

Fukn Putin dik sukkker!

Re: Why is there a fight over a wall?

PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 5:23 am
by waauw
This is what you get for polarizing american society, any chance at compromise goes down the drain. Maybe this should serve as a warning for both republicans AND democrats that they should stop villainizing eachother.

Re: Why is there a fight over a wall?

PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 9:22 am
by armati
Best answer yet mookie,

i gotta say tho I think its funny anyone woulda thought it was gonna be "free".

Re: Why is there a fight over a wall?

PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 4:21 pm
by tzor
Bernie Sanders wrote:Trump will get his wall, once he gets his @ss thrown in prison.


Wow, that's so deep. I am assuming you didn't think through the irony of the statement. :twisted:

You see, the symbol of the Democratic Party is the donkey (or @ss).
Now who is "Trump's Democrat?" Why Hillary of course!
And what to the Trump Supporters want? "Lock her up" of course!
You you are saying that should Hillary go behind bars, then all opposition to the wall will collapse (pardon the wall pun)?

Image

Well if we must ...

Re: Why is there a fight over a wall?

PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 5:41 pm
by Bernie Sanders
tzor wrote:
Bernie Sanders wrote:Trump will get his wall, once he gets his @ss thrown in prison.


Wow, that's so deep. I am assuming you didn't think through the irony of the statement. :twisted:

You see, the symbol of the Democratic Party is the donkey (or @ss).
Now who is "Trump's Democrat?" Why Hillary of course!
And what to the Trump Supporters want? "Lock her up" of course!
You you are saying that should Hillary go behind bars, then all opposition to the wall will collapse (pardon the wall pun)?

Image

Well if we must ...

Oh how I remember that Patriot General Flynn leading the chant, Lock her up! At the Republican Convention....

Look who's going to get locked up, ROTFLMAO!

Re: Why is there a fight over a wall?

PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 6:29 pm
by Symmetry
The thing that most disturbed me about Trump when he was campaigning was that he did so openly promising that he would jail his opponents.

The thing that gives me hope is that however much he breaks the system, he can't.

Re: Why is there a fight over a wall?

PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 7:00 pm
by armati
President Trump has made 7,645 false or misleading claims over 710 ...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/.../pres ... ing-clai...
Dec 21, 2018 - Unraveling President Trump's top 5 claims | The Fact Checker. Skip ... This has been updated with numbers as of Dec. 30. The numbers ... 26, when he held two rallies in advance of a special election in Mississippi: 90 claims.

The man lies so much it really is pointless listening to him, the best excuse for all the lies is he is keeping his opponents off balance.
I have no idea if thats true or not.

I guess if he gets troops moved out of Syria and Afghanistan, does not invade Venezuela or Korea, maybe that would show he is not part of the mic.

Pulling out of the inf sure makes him look like a psychopath tho.

So for me, he could go either way yet. Time will tell.

Re: Why is there a fight over a wall?

PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 7:22 pm
by Symmetry
armati wrote:President Trump has made 7,645 false or misleading claims over 710 ...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/.../pres ... ing-clai...
Dec 21, 2018 - Unraveling President Trump's top 5 claims | The Fact Checker. Skip ... This has been updated with numbers as of Dec. 30. The numbers ... 26, when he held two rallies in advance of a special election in Mississippi: 90 claims.

The man lies so much it really is pointless listening to him, the best excuse for all the lies is he is keeping his opponents off balance.
I have no idea if thats true or not.

I guess if he gets troops moved out of Syria and Afghanistan, does not invade Venezuela or Korea, maybe that would show he is not part of the mic.

Pulling out of the inf sure makes him look like a psychopath tho.

So for me, he could go either way yet. Time will tell.


If anything, the Trump presidency has shown the danger of a puppet presidency. It's not even necessary to worry about foreign powers, though that is a major concern. The people that surround him and influence him all seem like crooks, and far too often end up to be actual criminals.

Re: Why is there a fight over a wall?

PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 8:36 pm
by armati
Thats something I can agree with.
As far as Im concerned they (gov congress cia fbi tsa mic etc etc) corrupt from top to bottom.

Best government that can be bought.

Re: Why is there a fight over a wall?

PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 1:38 am
by mookiemcgee
Symmetry wrote:
armati wrote:President Trump has made 7,645 false or misleading claims over 710 ...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/.../pres ... ing-clai...
Dec 21, 2018 - Unraveling President Trump's top 5 claims | The Fact Checker. Skip ... This has been updated with numbers as of Dec. 30. The numbers ... 26, when he held two rallies in advance of a special election in Mississippi: 90 claims.

The man lies so much it really is pointless listening to him, the best excuse for all the lies is he is keeping his opponents off balance.
I have no idea if thats true or not.

I guess if he gets troops moved out of Syria and Afghanistan, does not invade Venezuela or Korea, maybe that would show he is not part of the mic.

Pulling out of the inf sure makes him look like a psychopath tho.

So for me, he could go either way yet. Time will tell.


If anything, the Trump presidency has shown the danger of a puppet presidency. It's not even necessary to worry about foreign powers, though that is a major concern. The people that surround him and influence him all seem like crooks, and far too often end up to be actual criminals.


I would disagree that he is a purely a puppet. He surrounds himself with crooks, and not because he's looking for their opinions or offering himself up to their influence. He is simply a crook, and he surrounds himself with crooks so everyone else can take the fall, and they are all very adept at keeping secrets. The more crazed and outlandish the people under him are they harder they fall, and I don't just mean criminally. Who is still in this administration from the start besides his family members? I don't honestly know but I can't think of one. Maybe there is some secretary of a non-news cycle dept, but from Chris Christie to Steve Bannon I mean the list is endless, and nothing stick to trump because he surrounds himself with super sticky people.

Re: Why is there a fight over a wall?

PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 7:24 pm
by karel
we true americans want a wall,sick of all these lazy ass free loaders coming over and getting all this free shit we offer

Re: Why is there a fight over a wall?

PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 7:27 pm
by Dukasaur
karel wrote:we true americans want a wall,sick of all these lazy ass free loaders coming over and getting all this free shit we offer

Those "lazy ass freeloaders" are the engine of your economy. They do all the backbreaking jobs your native sons won't touch. Your grocery stores would be empty in a week if you didn't have Mexicans to pick your tomatoes. Close the border and get ready to pay $12 for a pint of strawberries.

Re: Why is there a fight over a wall?

PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 8:04 pm
by mookiemcgee
Dukasaur wrote:
karel wrote:we true americans want a wall,sick of all these lazy ass free loaders coming over and getting all this free shit we offer

Those "lazy ass freeloaders" are the engine of your economy. They do all the backbreaking jobs your native sons won't touch. Your grocery stores would be empty in a week if you didn't have Mexicans to pick your tomatoes. Close the border and get ready to pay $12 for a pint of strawberries.



It's guaranteed that Karel has never done one day of work in his entire life that is as hard as a day of picking strawberries. I'd pay 2 to 1 odds he's never worked a day on a farm in his entire life that didn't involve just sitting on a tractor. I'm sure he lives in a landlocked state in the middle+north of the country and a wall would have zero effect on his life personally.

Re: Why is there a fight over a wall?

PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 8:22 pm
by karel
umm I lived on a farm so I know what hard work is damn snowflake,you know nothing about me so keep your damn thoughts to yourself

Re: Why is there a fight over a wall?

PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 8:23 pm
by karel
mookiemcgee wrote:
Dukasaur wrote:
karel wrote:we true americans want a wall,sick of all these lazy ass free loaders coming over and getting all this free shit we offer

Those "lazy ass freeloaders" are the engine of your economy. They do all the backbreaking jobs your native sons won't touch. Your grocery stores would be empty in a week if you didn't have Mexicans to pick your tomatoes. Close the border and get ready to pay $12 for a pint of strawberries.



It's guaranteed that Karel has never done one day of work in his entire life that is as hard as a day of picking strawberries. I'd pay 2 to 1 odds he's never worked a day on a farm in his entire life that didn't involve just sitting on a tractor. I'm sure he lives in a landlocked state in the middle+north of the country and a wall would have zero effect on his life personally.

you really are stupid,jack ass my taxes pay for these free loaders to get free stuff from hard working taxpayers

Re: Why is there a fight over a wall?

PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 8:38 pm
by armati
reading the thread, same thing posted over and over, takes an effort to see who says what.
takes practice I guess.

From what I can figure, 1 person is saying he pays for everything people get when immigrants come into his country, another person says the immigrants do the work "white boy" wont do.
Hows that for racist?

True tho, if immigrants were not doing the farm work...and cheap, the prices of food would be beyond what all those minimum wage jobs could pay for.

ok, so white boy starves, then learns to pick berries. As a second job maybe.

Obviously the solution is robotics and AI, then nobody has to work. :D

Re: Why is there a fight over a wall?

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 3:38 pm
by tzor
Dukasaur wrote:Those "lazy ass freeloaders" are the engine of your economy. They do all the backbreaking jobs your native sons won't touch. Your grocery stores would be empty in a week if you didn't have Mexicans to pick your tomatoes. Close the border and get ready to pay $12 for a pint of strawberries.


No, they are not. Lazy ass freeloaders are by definition lazy ass freeloaders.
Hard working immigrants, on the other hand, aren't lazy ass freeloaders.
As Milton Freedman once pointed out, you can have open borders or a welfare state but you can't have both at the same time.

First of all, I live in small farm country. "YOU PICK" is so popular here no one realizes that it was used by Mark Twain in Huck Finn.

With that out of the way, let's go into the economic politics of racist bastards.

The original purpose of minimum wage laws, created in the early 20th century was to prevent minorities, otherwise prohibited from joining unions, from getting jobs by offering to work for less money. While that is no longer the case today, it still creates a dilemma that manifests itself in the "undocumented" immigrant.

The "undocumented immigrant" (or literally anyone who wants to work "under the table" although laws actually apply to non illegal residents) is able to work for a wage set lower than the minimum wage + all the required benefit costs necessary to hire workers. Thus they represent an abundant supply of near slave labor. Business that needs such labor (especially owned by the Koch brothers) definitely want the under the radar less than minimum wage workers working for them.

So some products are cheaper (and Koch brothers are richer) but instead of more money going "through the system" a smaller pot of money is instead mostly going back to the home country as the undocumented immigrants send it to their relatives in their native lands. It's really a massive loss for the economy in every way; too many workers claiming too few jobs and sending that money out of the local economic system.

Not to mention that these workers aren't always the best workers and given the near slave conditions they experience a lot of problems in the food chain are directly related to the poor sanitary conditions of mega farms that try to go under the laws and regulations by paying people shit and giving them no decent facilities on the job.

There is an argument for the lazy young American, but this problem is actually higher up the chain and is due to the mentality that everyone should be in college when most people might actually be better off financially by going to a trade school (and some people might actually like those kind of jobs). But seriously, if a lot of people had to pay a whole lot more (seriously, strawberry prices is based on imports since the season is so short) they would probably just drive 60 miles to the nearest U PICK, do all the work and pat themselves on the back for being so frugal.

When's a fella get a chance to whitewash everyday?

Re: Why is there a fight over a wall?

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 9:14 pm
by Symmetry
mookiemcgee wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
armati wrote:President Trump has made 7,645 false or misleading claims over 710 ...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/.../pres ... ing-clai...
Dec 21, 2018 - Unraveling President Trump's top 5 claims | The Fact Checker. Skip ... This has been updated with numbers as of Dec. 30. The numbers ... 26, when he held two rallies in advance of a special election in Mississippi: 90 claims.

The man lies so much it really is pointless listening to him, the best excuse for all the lies is he is keeping his opponents off balance.
I have no idea if thats true or not.

I guess if he gets troops moved out of Syria and Afghanistan, does not invade Venezuela or Korea, maybe that would show he is not part of the mic.

Pulling out of the inf sure makes him look like a psychopath tho.

So for me, he could go either way yet. Time will tell.


If anything, the Trump presidency has shown the danger of a puppet presidency. It's not even necessary to worry about foreign powers, though that is a major concern. The people that surround him and influence him all seem like crooks, and far too often end up to be actual criminals.


I would disagree that he is a purely a puppet. He surrounds himself with crooks, and not because he's looking for their opinions or offering himself up to their influence. He is simply a crook, and he surrounds himself with crooks so everyone else can take the fall, and they are all very adept at keeping secrets. The more crazed and outlandish the people under him are they harder they fall, and I don't just mean criminally. Who is still in this administration from the start besides his family members? I don't honestly know but I can't think of one. Maybe there is some secretary of a non-news cycle dept, but from Chris Christie to Steve Bannon I mean the list is endless, and nothing stick to trump because he surrounds himself with super sticky people.


I'm not so sure that the people he surrounds himself with are all that great at keeping secrets, tbh.

Re: Why is there a fight over a wall?

PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:26 pm
by mookiemcgee
Symmetry wrote:
mookiemcgee wrote:
Symmetry wrote:
armati wrote:President Trump has made 7,645 false or misleading claims over 710 ...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/.../pres ... ing-clai...
Dec 21, 2018 - Unraveling President Trump's top 5 claims | The Fact Checker. Skip ... This has been updated with numbers as of Dec. 30. The numbers ... 26, when he held two rallies in advance of a special election in Mississippi: 90 claims.

The man lies so much it really is pointless listening to him, the best excuse for all the lies is he is keeping his opponents off balance.
I have no idea if thats true or not.

I guess if he gets troops moved out of Syria and Afghanistan, does not invade Venezuela or Korea, maybe that would show he is not part of the mic.

Pulling out of the inf sure makes him look like a psychopath tho.

So for me, he could go either way yet. Time will tell.


If anything, the Trump presidency has shown the danger of a puppet presidency. It's not even necessary to worry about foreign powers, though that is a major concern. The people that surround him and influence him all seem like crooks, and far too often end up to be actual criminals.


I would disagree that he is a purely a puppet. He surrounds himself with crooks, and not because he's looking for their opinions or offering himself up to their influence. He is simply a crook, and he surrounds himself with crooks so everyone else can take the fall, and they are all very adept at keeping secrets. The more crazed and outlandish the people under him are they harder they fall, and I don't just mean criminally. Who is still in this administration from the start besides his family members? I don't honestly know but I can't think of one. Maybe there is some secretary of a non-news cycle dept, but from Chris Christie to Steve Bannon I mean the list is endless, and nothing stick to trump because he surrounds himself with super sticky people.


I'm not so sure that the people he surrounds himself with are all that great at keeping secrets, tbh.


Is Trump still President? I rest my case.