Do you support the Pro-Freedom Venezuelan Demonstrators?

[GTE]

How was it illegal to refuse to renew the station's license? It is the president's decision. He is given the power to renew or not to renew by the constitution. It's legal. Stop bitching.

This may be news to you Helmut but Chavez was elected by a free society. The President has no right to deny a license to a TV station. The key to a free society is the freedom of the press, take it away and you have a dictator. Chavez is heading in that direction. Please tell me a Country where a dictator shared the resources with the people. I think you need to do some research because it's not like that anywhere. The population has become poorer while unemployment has increased. How come you live in the USA if you hate it so much? Why don't you go live in a country where a dictator rules? Live there for a few years and then talk. By the way, where do you teach?

[Anarchist]

GTE- I announce that Bush is a dictator, he imposes his will on me by not allowing me to get high,kill myself,have an abortion,burn the flag or otherwise live my life without effecting others thats illegal that I cant think of.

KSS,
You obviously dont know anything about Chavo nor the Socialist revolution. I admit the chances of corruption are high, but personally believe that they are lower then here(USA)

The Socialist revolution is dedicated to the redistribution of wealth,free education and healthcare,the right to bare arms, and to encourage cooperation over competition. Consider not whats most proffitable to you but what will have the most positive effect on society and your quality of life.

Something that capitalism has failed to do, unless you are able to obtain obscene amounts of wealth.

While you will dissmiss Socialism as an Utopian idea, I still consider it better then your system of exploitation for profits. While Anarchy is ideal to me, I see socialism as a step in that direction. While the land of the free is heading completely in the opposite direction. A fascist Elitist one with law enforcement being the number one job oppertunity(for our safety? For his!)

[Guiscard]

How was it illegal to refuse to renew the station's license? It is the president's decision. He is given the power to renew or not to renew by the constitution. It's legal. Stop bitching.

Why do you go around posting rude crap? They support it because the people of venezuela think its illegal you twit, if the people of the country don't support their leaders action then that is immoral and illegal, the people should rule not the man.

ROFL, the "people of Venezuela"? What bullshit is this? The "people of Venezuela" support Chavez. They elected him and they support him - he consistently scores around 70% in opinion polls. It's the American goverment that doesn't support him. They see him as a dangerous opponent of American globalization.

Try not to be a lemming. Do a little research, and develop your own ideas instead of mindlessly believing everything Fox News tells you.

Yeah, but there is a legitimate opposition (even if 70% voted for Chavez...) and even if it's mostly a pro-American corporatist agenda, they deserve to have their views represented.

This is the sum total of this thread. Chavez has a lit of support, and many applaud his stance in sticking up for himself against US interests and trying to form a more economically independent South American bloc, but he is also in no way squeaky clean and there also is significant opposition (as you said, based largely around pro-US groups). It is in no way a perfect socialist revolution, and those on the left you hold him up as a hero go to far, but neither is he a South American demon repressing his people's freedom.

And for fucks sake, the TV station had repeatedly called for the overthrow of the legally elected Chavez government. That would be illegal in the UK and in the USA... It isn't an infringement of freedoms if you're breaking the law.

[Backglass]

ROFL, the "people of Venezuela"? What bullshit is this? The "people of Venezuela" support Chavez. They elected him and they support him - he consistently scores around 70% in opinion polls.

Corrupt polls conducted and tabulated by a corrupt government. Have you been to Venezuela and talked to actual people? I have five times, the last time one year ago. Never did I meet anyone who spoke favorably of Chavez. Of course they always talk about him in whispers because if you speak out in public, the next day your home is firebombed.

Try not to be a lemming. Do a little research, and develop your own ideas instead of mindlessly believing everything Fox News tells you.

And where exactly are you getting YOUR info? Talk to any Venezuelans lately? I agree that FOX news sucks.

• Yes...he won the election. - He bought the votes and oversaw the vote tally
• Yes...he has a 70% approval rating. - He tabulates the polls.
• Yes...he is legally removing private radio & television. - Goodbye freedom of speech.
• He is already talking about removing term limits from the constitution, meaning he could be "democratically elected" forever. - See above.

He is a dictator plain & simple and only squeezing his grip tighter by the day.

[btownmeggy]

Corrupt polls conducted and tabulated by a corrupt government.

Do a quick google search for "Chavez Approval Ratings". You'll see that variety of polling firms with a variety of nationalities give fairly consistent reports of Chavez's popularity, around that 70% line.

Have you been to Venezuela and talked to actual people? I have five times, the last time one year ago. Never did I meet anyone who spoke favorably of Chavez.

Yes, I have, for considerable lengths of time. I might ask you, What neighborhoods and cities were you staying in? What were the professions of the people you spoke with? In the $15/night hotels and rural posadas that I stayed in, I heard a lot of good things about Chavez. On the airplanes back and forth, the Texas A&M-educated Venezuelan oilmen, admittedly, did not have much good to say about him. So who's right? Me and the people I talked to, you and the people you talked to, or the statisticians who do inclusive and broad-reaching studies into national opinion?

Of course they always talk about him in whispers because if you speak out in public, the next day your home is firebombed.

Firebombed? FIREBOMBED? I'd love to see an example of this. I'd take it even from a pretty dubious news source and might even have my view of world politics turned upside down. Oh please, give me an example.

And where exactly are you getting YOUR info? Talk to any Venezuelans lately? I agree that FOX news sucks.

• Yes...he won the election. - He bought the votes and oversaw the vote tally
• Yes...he has a 70% approval rating. - He tabulates the polls.

We've already covered this...

He is already talking about removing term limits from the constitution, meaning he could be "democratically elected" forever. - See above.He is a dictator plain & simple and only squeezing his grip tighter by the day.

Ahhhh, so now you're getting into something! While I don't believe that Venezuela is already not a democracy, I think it's in some ways on a dangerous path away from democracy. If Venezuela arrives at the end of that path, the Bolivarian Revolution will be delegitimized precisely because it was born in the name of democracy.

[Backglass]

Yes, I have, for considerable lengths of time. I might ask you, What neighborhoods and cities were you staying in?

All my visits were to Caracas and vicinity.

In the $15/night hotels and rural posadas that I stayed in, I heard a lot of good things about Chavez.

Sure...he is Robin Hood to them! After all...the rich and the gringo's are screwing over the poor...right? Reclaim the farms, reclaim the oil, reclaim the media. Give the farms away, keep the oil for the coffers and broadcast Chavez 5-hour propaganda speeches (complete with singing) every day.

Firebombed? FIREBOMBED? I'd love to see an example of this.

Yes! YES! I only know what was told to me by Venezuelans I met...perhaps they were lying, but I believed them. Every time Chavez came up in a bar or restaurant they would lower there voice and glance about. These aren't oil millionaires, but normal everyday people. Why are they so afraid?

I think it's in some ways on a dangerous path away from democracy. If Venezuela arrives at the end of that path, the Bolivarian Revolution will be delegitimized precisely because it was born in the name of democracy.

Exactly. On this we agree.

[ksslemp]

This cracks me up! This post has been viewed 336 times up to this point and only 21 people have bothered to vote.

I guess in their defense, it is a very small dot!
21! pathetic

[Anarchist]

cause we keep checking to see if youve actually defended against our arguements

left wing article on the subject
http://www.marxist.com/counterrevolutio ... 010607.htm

[Iliad]

This cracks me up! This post has been viewed 336 times up to this point and only 21 people have bothered to vote.

I guess in their defense, it is a very small dot!
21! pathetic

No it's not.

[ksslemp]

cause we keep checking to see if youve actually defended against our arguements

left wing article on the subject
http://www.marxist.com/counterrevolutio ... 010607.htm

Life is short and i learned a long time ago that some people are devoid of reason and unfortunately will never "get it".

In case your momma hasn't told you, you're one of them!

[Anarchist]

your best comeback is an insult?

Wow, I love your debating skills there chump

[Iliad]

cause we keep checking to see if youve actually defended against our arguements

left wing article on the subject
http://www.marxist.com/counterrevolutio ... 010607.htm

Life is short and i learned a long time ago that some people are devoid of reason and unfortunately will never "get it".

In case your momma hasn't told you, you're one of them!

If you tried to debate with him....you failed.


If you tried to flame him....you failed.

Well fucking done.

[ksslemp]

cause we keep checking to see if youve actually defended against our arguements

left wing article on the subject
http://www.marxist.com/counterrevolutio ... 010607.htm

Life is short and i learned a long time ago that some people are devoid of reason and unfortunately will never "get it".

In case your momma hasn't told you, you're one of them!

If you tried to debate with him....you failed.


If you tried to flame him....you failed.

Well fucking done.

I was Enlightening Her to the fact, in order to shield Her from a lifetime of ridicule!

Just trying to help.

[Iliad]

cause we keep checking to see if youve actually defended against our arguements

left wing article on the subject
http://www.marxist.com/counterrevolutio ... 010607.htm

Life is short and i learned a long time ago that some people are devoid of reason and unfortunately will never "get it".

In case your momma hasn't told you, you're one of them!

If you tried to debate with him....you failed.


If you tried to flame him....you failed.

Well fucking done.

I was Enlightening Her to the fact, in order to shield Her from a lifetime of ridicule!

Just trying to help.

first of all post without colours, it is very annoying. And second of all no you didn't you flamed Anarchist.

[got tonkaed]

as a public service announcement....

ksslemp likes posting in colors. They find their way into every post. People have on occasion attempted to get him to stop doing so and he has made it known that he likes using the colored texts for emphasis. Further attemps to do so will merely drive up your post count....

[Iliad]

as a public service announcement....

ksslemp likes posting in colors. They find their way into every post. People have on occasion attempted to get him to stop doing so and he has made it known that he likes using the colored texts for emphasis. Further attemps to do so will merely drive up your post count....

Sounds good to me

[ksslemp]

as a public service announcement....

ksslemp likes posting in colors. They find their way into every post. People have on occasion attempted to get him to stop doing so and he has made it known that he likes using the colored texts for emphasis. Further attemps to do so will merely drive up your post count....

I've only been asked to stop posting in "Colours", which i've done.
Now i only post in "Colors".

You're Welcome!

[Iliad]

as a public service announcement....

ksslemp likes posting in colors. They find their way into every post. People have on occasion attempted to get him to stop doing so and he has made it known that he likes using the colored texts for emphasis. Further attemps to do so will merely drive up your post count....

I've only been asked to stop posting in "Colours", which i've done.
Now i only post in "Colors".

You're Welcome!

Colors and colours are the same thing.

You are a retard.

[ksslemp]

as a public service announcement....

ksslemp likes posting in colors. They find their way into every post. People have on occasion attempted to get him to stop doing so and he has made it known that he likes using the colored texts for emphasis. Further attemps to do so will merely drive up your post count....

I've only been asked to stop posting in "Colours", which i've done.
Now i only post in "Colors".

You're Welcome!

Colors and colours are the same thing.

You are a retard.

No Shit Sherlock!

Damn you're Denser than a black hole!

[Iliad]

as a public service announcement....

ksslemp likes posting in colors. They find their way into every post. People have on occasion attempted to get him to stop doing so and he has made it known that he likes using the colored texts for emphasis. Further attemps to do so will merely drive up your post count....

I've only been asked to stop posting in "Colours", which i've done.
Now i only post in "Colors".

You're Welcome!

Colors and colours are the same thing.

You are a retard.

No Shit Sherlock!

Damn you're Denser than a black hole!

You are one lost cause aren't you

[Neutrino]

cause we keep checking to see if youve actually defended against our arguements

left wing article on the subject
http://www.marxist.com/counterrevolutio ... 010607.htm

[bLife is short and i learned a long time ago that some people are devoid of reason and unfortunately will never "get it".
[/b]
[b]In case your momma hasn't told you,/b] you're one of them!

Wha...?

If you are going to put up even the vaguest attempt at a valid argument, then you really should read the article. You are making a huge fuss ofer something that is really simple.

Mouse pointer ofer the link... depress left mouse button firmly... wait... read article...

Not. that. difficult.

As it is, you have turned this thread into a flamefest over something that would have taken 5-10 minutes.

I understand that you think that reading something from marxist.com is relitavly pointless, but how can you even make a pretence of debate if you wont even read your oppositions points?

[Stopper]

This cracks me up! This post has been viewed 336 times up to this point and only 21 people have bothered to vote.

I guess in their defense, it is a very small dot!
21! pathetic

Maybe that's because most people realise that the poll question, as it stands, is biased towards the outcome that you want.

[ksslemp]

This cracks me up! This post has been viewed 336 times up to this point and only 21 people have bothered to vote.

I guess in their defense, it is a very small dot!
21! pathetic

Maybe that's because most people realise that the poll question, as it stands, is biased towards the outcome that you want.

I'll create a poll for the "I want to sit on my ass smoking crack all day and have the Gov't send me a check" Demonstrators later.

Just to keep it balanced

[Anarchist]

The truth is a three edged sword.Our side,Their side, and the Truth.

If you only know one side, you will never learn the truth in the middle.

Whose that in your Avater? Looks like a Giant, I hate the Giants!

[pancakemix]

You forgot the GFY option.