Capital Punishment

[Smurf75]

I have hard time believing that story, because wouldn't he goto jail in whatever country he came from?

Apparently he didnt know that, honestly I dont know where he makes his time. And to answer the question, I think it depends from case to case.

And it is easy to support revenge and not see the big picture.

I support capital punishment not because of revenge but beause more or less like the second poster stated... it prevents second time offenders

Sure, every system has its setbacks, letting prisons go on holiday naturally has the chance that someone might try to escape. But it requires both courage and wisdom to defend a better system when populistic bricks can go out saying that "oo, the criminals have so comfortable living these days, that they're almost like hotels."

Finland has better prisons than sweden(tougher)... but a comparison made a few years ago actually made it clear that the food in prison actually is more expensive than the one served in retirement homes(or what the correct name is)

If you show me a study that shows that capital punishment has benefits on general safety and prevents more crimes than it causes, then I am surprised. The best I've seen are that in some cases capital punishment doesn't increase crime, but most studies I'm familiar with shows that capital punishment brutalises the criminal & causes more harm than good.

Cannot do that, just speaking my mind here. But it sounds like you can show a studie that proves otherwise? Ofcourse it brutalise the criminal, then again, how much respect do you have for convicted murders?

When it comes to your example scenario, you don't have big faith in doctors and science do you?

Once again I have to refer to Sweden. Two killers in approx 4 years. Serving a total of 18 months. One doctor declared one guy sane after 6 months if I recall correctly and another doctor needed 12 whole months to release his patient. I dont have any links, but if you doubt it I can google some more. To ask your question. NO!

And besides, most murderers are just average people like you or me. There isn't a mass murderer gene that is out there that causes people to kill. I have trouble believing that other countrymen would by nature have more murderers in them either. At least in Finland most murder cases are done while drunk. And just imagine the consequences that if you killed someone out of burst of anger and then when you realise what you've done there would be a chance of capital punishment.

I think neither of us wants to start an argument with a convicted killer at the local pub, especially if he commited his crime under the influence of alcohol. If it were me slaying a man that way, I highly doubt I would like to live on. Other countrymen beeing worse?... no I dont think so either.. so we can agree on that one

Imagaine the consequenses of killing a man because of drunk driving.... do we drive drunk? Yes! Why? Because we are stupid! Why does it happen? Because of bad luck while doing stupid thing. Does Stupid people with bad luck contribute to this world in any way. Kill them all. Feel free to ignore this last part. Im still a little drunk from yesterday and are writing under the influence of alchol.

Feel free be drunk... and prepare to face the consequences(cause there always are).

[Jucdor]

If you show me a study that shows that capital punishment has benefits on general safety and prevents more crimes than it causes, then I am surprised. The best I've seen are that in some cases capital punishment doesn't increase crime, but most studies I'm familiar with shows that capital punishment brutalises the criminal & causes more harm than good.

Cannot do that, just speaking my mind here. But it sounds like you can show a studie that proves otherwise? Ofcourse it brutalise the criminal, then again, how much respect do you have for convicted murders?

Sure thing. Look on the Deterrence Effect -part. http://www.msu.edu/~millettf/DeathPenalty/practical.html.
Or let me quote:
"Hundreds of studies have also been done concerning the deterrence effect of capital punishment. The fact is, the death penalty does not deter murders from occurring. In one study done in Oklahoma, it was found that after Oklahoma resumed capital punishment, no deterrent effect was found - in fact, a brutalization effect (increase in homicides) was reported. This means that capital punishment doesn't lower crime rates, but in fact raises them. William Bailey, author of the report in Oklahoma, also found a significant increase in stranger-related deaths after Oklahoma resumed the death penalty. In other reports in Texas and California, the same information was reported - proving that the death penalty almost never has a deterrent effect on crime."

And when it comes to convicted murderers and respect... well...first of all I don't think you got my point on the brutalising effect. If capital punishment brutalises murderers then it is a matter of serious concern, because that means there will be more murders and thus less safe country. And second of all people can change. Not every murderer is helplessly bad.

When it comes to your example scenario, you don't have big faith in doctors and science do you?

Once again I have to refer to Sweden. Two killers in approx 4 years. Serving a total of 18 months. One doctor declared one guy sane after 6 months if I recall correctly and another doctor needed 12 whole months to release his patient. I dont have any links, but if you doubt it I can google some more. To ask your question. NO!

Then hooray! The doctors must've cured them. I am sure the doctors won't take any chances to end up being THE doctor(TM) who released the criminal who now murdered again. It's news if you can show me that these people killed again. Or if you can prove that they were not mentally sick at the time of the murders.

[2dimes]

Okay.........what's a ring piece? Or do I not want to know?

They're like opinions - everyone has one.

And your's stinks!

Not possible considering my feces doesn't

Okay I guess we have to go back to that whole pride conversation now

I wasn't really refering to you I was just finishing the catch phrase.

The first time I heard the last part was on an episode of 'merican chopper. Paul senior said the whole thing it was extra funny to me.

"Opinions are like ring pieces, everyone has one and your's stinks!"

[CrazyAnglican]

Okay.........what's a ring piece? Or do I not want to know?

They're like opinions - everyone has one.

And your's stinks!

Not possible considering my feces doesn't

Okay I guess we have to go back to that whole pride conversation now

I wasn't really refering to you I was just finishing the catch phrase.

The first time I heard the last part was on an episode of 'merican chopper. Paul senior said the whole thing it was extra funny to me.

"Opinions are like ring pieces, everyone has one and your's stinks!"

Yeah, I didn't really think so from talking to you in the past. I just couldn't resist.

[beezer]

beezer, as you can see from my posts, i have no problem killing someone if they attack me or mine. But i cannot say that is the christian thing to do, and i don't try to justify it. I don't follow the Lord. You talk a lot about the Bible, but you know very little about it if you think a believer should impose death as a punishment. The New Testament is very clear about forgiveness (see Lord's Prayer), and not only that, but he clearly states that if you don't forgive, you won't be forgiven. Show me a New Testament validation of your argument.

Well, my schedule was pretty busy during the end of April. By this time the whole debate has probably wound down. Suffice it to say that I read luns' response and it seems pretty valid. Despite my faith, I still think that capital punishment is just a natural common sense solution to dealing with cold-blooded killers. All this nonsense about not "stooping down to the level of the murderer" is just a bunch of cowardice for not being able to stand for what is right, in my opinion.