Conquer Club

Does some graphics/programming expert want to put together a Somali Pirates map? Could be the Gulf of Aden, Horn of Africa, relevant islands, port cities, and a few prized cargo ships and enemy naval groups.

I'd do it myself but I'm a graphic design idiot.

joon wrote:Does some graphics/programming expert want to put together a Somali Pirates map? Could be the Gulf of Aden, Horn of Africa, relevant islands, port cities, and a few prized cargo ships and enemy naval groups.

I'd do it myself but I'm a graphic design idiot.

If I was going to spend time on a pirate map I'd rather do something using "fun" pirates - parrots and buried treasures and everybody saying "avast" and such. The Somali piracy situation is, in my humble opinion, too sad.

Isn't that basically the same idea as the Bombs Away!/Pirates suggestion of viewtopic.php?f=63&t=69664?

Way to be a party pooper, Oaktown.

Also we have a map based on the Iraq War. How sad does that make you?

I'm a big fan of political incorrectness, don't get me wrong. But I think this map would really just be a weak Western impression of what's going on, and wouldn't fairly treat the situation. Honestly, does anyone actually know what's going on there? There has been very little real information coming out of that region for decades, all we know is what the media tells us, and it's hardly like they're at ground level. Sure, we hear about the piracy off the coast, it's infamous, but what do we know about who's behind it? What sort of assumptions would you be making? Would you really want to portray a potentially narrow-minded representation of an entire country?

e_i_pi wrote:I'm a big fan of political incorrectness, don't get me wrong. But I think this map would really just be a weak Western impression of what's going on, and wouldn't fairly treat the situation. Honestly, does anyone actually know what's going on there? There has been very little real information coming out of that region for decades, all we know is what the media tells us, and it's hardly like they're at ground level. Sure, we hear about the piracy off the coast, it's infamous, but what do we know about who's behind it? What sort of assumptions would you be making? Would you really want to portray a potentially narrow-minded representation of an entire country?

I guess I'm not sure how this is political. The events and participants have been pretty clear cut. Commercial vessels coming through the Suez have been seized by Pirates based in Eyl, and a number of other Somali and Yemeni port havens. The American, French and Indian navies have been patrolling the area and escorting ships through dangerous waters.

See? I made no "narrow" Westernized caricature of an entire country. Don't be so heavy handed (and I resent the implication that I or other Westerners don't understand the complexity of the situation. We're not all Sarah Palin knockoffs).

joon wrote:

e_i_pi wrote:I'm a big fan of political incorrectness, don't get me wrong. But I think this map would really just be a weak Western impression of what's going on, and wouldn't fairly treat the situation. Honestly, does anyone actually know what's going on there? There has been very little real information coming out of that region for decades, all we know is what the media tells us, and it's hardly like they're at ground level. Sure, we hear about the piracy off the coast, it's infamous, but what do we know about who's behind it? What sort of assumptions would you be making? Would you really want to portray a potentially narrow-minded representation of an entire country?

I guess I'm not sure how this is political. The events and participants have been pretty clear cut. Commercial vessels coming through the Suez have been seized by Pirates based in Eyl, and a number of other Somali and Yemeni port havens.

The ships are siezed in the Gulf of Aden, not the Suez, which is Egyptian territorial waters. They come from Puntland, but allegedly get their weapons from Yemen.

The American, French and Indian navies have been patrolling the area and escorting ships through dangerous waters.

Well, it's NATO that's been assisting with escorts, so you can include Canada, Denmark, Germany, Greece, Holland, Italy, Spain, Turkey, and the UK as well. Also, Sweden, Japan, Malaysia, South Africa, Saudi Arabia, and Russia have sent ships. France has not officially deployed any ships as part of the NATO task force, but Somalia has allowed them entry into their territorial waters to assist in deterring piratical acts.

See? I made no "narrow" Westernized caricature of an entire country. Don't be so heavy handed (and I resent the implication that I or other Westerners don't understand the complexity of the situation. We're not all Sarah Palin knockoffs).

Furthermore, the situation is something that has ballooned out of control only in the past 12 months. Before 2008, only a handful of ships had been siezed off the coast of Puntland. The attacks are now spreading to the coast of Kenya.

There is no task force assigned to eradicate the pirates, and no hint of a NATO led mission to deploy troops in Somalia to deal with the issue at ground level. I don't know how you would propose to make this map a good representation of what's going on. What is happening is ships are being siezed off the coasts of Somalia and Kenya, one pirate ship got eradicated a few days ago, and a few months ago the French killed I think 6 pirates and captured 1, then turning him over to Somali authorities. There is no actual war going on, the conflict is limited to piracy, abduction, and blackmail, and the nature of the pirates activities on the mainland are open to debate.

I also appreciate your resentment of my implication, but I was not implying anything, I was stating a fact. Western media does not know what is going on in that region, and is making assumptions. Somalia has been an extremely dangerous warzone for many many years, and what we hear from the media is hearsay and conjecture.

The ships are siezed in the Gulf of Aden, not the Suez, which is Egyptian territorial waters. They come from Puntland, but allegedly get their weapons from Yemen.

I said they come through the Suez - I didn't say they were being seized in the Suez. Where does the Suez connect? Eventually to The Gulf of Aden (which I believe I mentioned in my initial post).

I think its hilarious that you think your information and assessment is better than "the Western media." Get over yourself.

You didn't give this idea any consideration. You just assumed it would fit some inaccurate caricature without any discussion. Nice job jumping to conclusions. There is some really interesting geography here, and some really interesting non-geographic participants. But thanks for attacking it based on some strangely absurd assumptions you've made. Way to jump the gun.

Well this map idea has officially descended into heavy handed, know it all vitriol. I guess I withdraw my suggestion - regardless of how interesting the geography and non-geographic participants are.

Then base the map on the geography, but don't typecast the region or the people there. The pirates make up roughly 0.01% of the population there, and there is not even a military campaign going on. You introduced this thread with talk of pirates, naval groups, prize cargo ships - I think this is a sensationalised view of what is going on there. How would you feel if someone made a map about Zimbabwe where you had to conquer all the white mans farms, or Afghanistan where you have to bombard all the ancient religious sites? A shameful series of recent events is hardly justification for tarring and feathering a region of the world with it.

I reckon it's easier just to say "No, no one wants any part of that terrible idea. Make it yourself, and wait for it to be rejected."

Look, in all honesty, I think it would make a geographically interesting area, make the Gulf of Aden map, that would be cool. I don't see a need to add in the idea that it's a warzone where pirates and army duke it out for control of a region.

e_i_pi wrote:Then base the map on the geography, but don't typecast the region or the people there. The pirates make up roughly 0.01% of the population there, and there is not even a military campaign going on. You introduced this thread with talk of pirates, naval groups, prize cargo ships - I think this is a sensationalised view of what is going on there. How would you feel if someone made a map about Zimbabwe where you had to conquer all the white mans farms, or Afghanistan where you have to bombard all the ancient religious sites? A shameful series of recent events is hardly justification for tarring and feathering a region of the world with it.

HOLY SCHNIKES, SIMMER DOWN.

Nobody is tarring and feathering anybody. Nobody is making broad claims on all Somalians.

Fact: Pirates are raiding commercial ships off the horn of Africa.

Fact: They are primarily based out of Somalia (or the factions of it), possibly with help from Yemenis. Nobody is claiming all people from the Horn of Africa are pirates. Cripeys.

Fact: A variety of nations have small naval contingents present present in the area - they are engaging piracy.

Fact: There are politically sensitive maps in play right now (Iraq, development of English India map, etc). So this objection is irrelevant.

Fact: "Military campaign" need not be the premise of any map (Prison riot, conquerman, city mogul, etc). So, this premise is moot.

Fact: Yes I introduced this thread with talk of Pirates, prized cargo ships, and naval intervention. Go read the BBC, New York Times, Al-Jazeera, etc., and you'll find the same "sensationalism."

Fact: You are over reacting to an amazing degree.

Love,

Joon

what?!!?!?!?!

this thread is ridiculous... i wholeheartedly do not support this idea because i don't want people to hate pirates

HAven't you all seem "Pirates of the Carabeean"? Pirates are just normal people who are defending their freedoms. This map woul make tham seem bad.