Conquer Club

Version 2:


Version 1

I've had the idea of a Battle of Hastings map floating in my head for a little while.

The idea is to have the general area of the South-East of England with Norman boats coming across the English Channel, and an inset of the battle-ground

Does this idea have any merit?

Sample images that I might use as a basis are:

MrBenn wrote:I've had the idea of a Battle of Hastings map floating in my head for a little while.

The idea is to have the general area of the South-East of England with Norman boats coming across the English Channel, and an inset of the battle-ground

Does this idea have any merit?

Are you kidding? Of course.

And here is some info from the "Battles That Changed History - The Fifty Decisive of 2500 Years of Warfare" by Geoffrey Regan P49....

English
Commanders" KKing Harold and his brothers Gyrth and Leofwine
Numbers: 2000 housecards, 5000 fyrdmen

Normans
Commander: William of Normandy
Left Wing: Count Alan of Brittany
Centre: William Normandy
Right Wing: Eustace of Boulogne
Numbers: 8000 archers, infantry and cavalry

Hope this diagram helps towards your final product.

Okay, I just squealed like a little girl when I saw the thread title...

So, yes, please do make a Hastings map. But I would vote for a battle map, rather than your first image, which appears to be more of a campaign map.

Graphically, you can't go wrong using the Bayeux Tapestry as some sort of backdrop/flourish.

And just to warn you, I'm reasonably knowledgeable about the battle (and the surrounding circumstances), so I'll prolly be a pain in the butt.

Incandenza wrote:Okay, I just squealed like a little girl when I saw the thread title...

So, yes, please do make a Hastings map. But I would vote for a battle map, rather than your first image, which appears to be more of a campaign map.

Graphically, you can't go wrong using the Bayeux Tapestry as some sort of backdrop/flourish.

And just to warn you, I'm reasonably knowledgeable about the battle (and the surrounding circumstances), so I'll prolly be a pain in the butt.

I think you mean unreasonably knowledgeable, by the sound of it...

Incandenza wrote:Okay, I just squealed like a little girl...

Should I be afraid?

Incandenza wrote:So, yes, please do make a Hastings map. But I would vote for a battle map, rather than your first image, which appears to be more of a campaign map.

In my head I've got a bit of both going on... setting the scene with Saxon troops caught up North, Norman armies coming over the channel, and then the melee on the Senlac plain...
Hopefully I'll be able to get a combination of the whole campaign, and the actual battle.

Incandenza wrote:Graphically, you can't go wrong using the Bayeux Tapestry as some sort of backdrop/flourish.

I've seen pictures, but am tempted to actually go and have a look at it

MrBenn wrote:In my head I've got a bit of both going on... setting the scene with Saxon troops caught up North, Norman armies coming over the channel, and then the melee on the Senlac plain... Hopefully I'll be able to get a combination of the whole campaign, and the actual battle.

Seems tricky, if for no other reason a campaign map might end up being little different from a basic map of England from York southward...

UNLESS you folded the Danes and the Battle of Stamford Bridge into the equation, and just call the map "England 1066" or something.

MrBenn wrote:

Incandenza wrote:Graphically, you can't go wrong using the Bayeux Tapestry as some sort of backdrop/flourish.

I've seen pictures, but am tempted to actually go and have a look at it

I saw it back when I was in high school. It's incredible, I highly recommend nipping across the channel next time you get the chance. Might give you some good ideas.

Another idea would be to have two maps, one a basic england map with a dozen or so terits, and then insets for Hastings and/or the Channel crossing and/or Stamford Bridge, which would be more complicated.

Annoyingly I'd had this idea floating around my head as well but I guess I've got enough projects. You could do a series out of it and make a 1066:Stamford Bridge map as well.

Incandenza wrote:Another idea would be to have two maps, one a basic england map with a dozen or so terits, and then insets for Hastings and/or the Channel crossing and/or Stamford Bridge, which would be more complicated.

This is the sort of thing I've had going on in my head, along with archer bombardments, possible 'capital' bonusses for holding the Kings (of which there would be 3 or 4: William, Harold, Tostig & Harald?) - or even an objective of holding all the kings and calling peace in the land? (ha ha)

I've put together a 1st draft. Bear in mind that it is VERY draft!


In my head, the beginning of the game would see battles to take either the Saxon/Norman army (in order to secure reinforcements for the main battle); once the initial phase of fighting is over, the skirmishes would move onto the battlefield, where the bonus would be territorial only...

I seen where you're going with this, but I can tell you that directed gameplay's a tough road, unless the initial drop is going to be conquest-style. For instance, Waterloo very rarely (if at all) comes down to anything approaching British vs. French. The upshot is that battles on this map won't conform to how the battle/campaign went historically.

There's a lot of crazy stuff you can do with the bonuses and terits, too. Y'know, own x terits in england, get the +1 fyrd bonus. Make the line of housecarls impenetrable (which they in fact were until the bitter end). Maybe there's could be some sort of cumulative bonus based around William's papal sanction. Or you get a larger bonus for holding both a key part of a given army and the area such a force would have been raised from (this would prolly require adding more of Normandy at the expense of the north). Unfortunately the xml won't support this (to my knowledge), but given the inadequacies of period navigation, it would be cool if the ships (should you decide to keep them) attack random coastal terits along southern england.

I'm not saying these are all good ideas, just throwing some stuff out there, see if it helps with this initial layout stage.

There must be some way to facilitate a more Saxon v Norman battle.... perhaps we could tinker with the XML a bit...

Example:
Let's say that there are 30 Saxon terrs, and 30 Norman terrs.
Bonusses as follows:

If you hold more Saxon terrs, then +1 for every 3 Saxon terr. (max +10)
Bonus for holding strategic Saxon terrs. (+3)
Hold King Harold = +1 for every 5 Saxon terrs (max +6)
If you hold Norman terrs, then +1 for every 3 Norman terrs. (max +10)
Bonus for holding strategic Norman terrs. (+3)
Hold King William = +1 for every 5 Norman terrs (max +6)

Just an idea - I'm sure this sort of thing is do-able...

Incandenza wrote:Okay, I just squealed like a little girl when I saw the thread title...

Most definitely...

C.

this looks like a job for qwert or cairns.

MrBenn wrote:There must be some way to facilitate a more Saxon v Norman battle.... perhaps we could tinker with the XML a bit...

Well, you've already sorta got it set up so that it''s somewhat arms race style, i.e.the anglo-saxons have their terits and the normans have their terits and one can't attack the other except thru hastings... theoretically you'd make EVERYTHING in hastings neutral (mostly 1s or 2s, but maybe a couple higher for bonus purposes), and everyone gets dropped throughout england and normandy, so the goal is to consolidate your territory, then move into hastings for lucrative bonuses and move beyond to crush the opponent(s).

Great idea for a map, I'm sure there are many keen historians who will be more than happy to give you lots of supportive feedback on this project.
Personally, I think that you should focus just on the battle at Senlac hill itself.
An alternative map could be called 'Claims to the throne in 1066' and could include Britain (Harold Godwin), Normandy (William) and Norway (Harald Hardrada).
I think that the map could become overcomplicated and a little ugly if you try to combine both ideas into the same map, as you appear to be considering at present.

Update: Version 2

So, first update...

The colour-scheme will be parchmenty, to give an aged feeling.
I've added some Norman boats from the Bayeux Tapestry - the idea is that these could be territories; at the moment I'm thinking about using more images from the tapestry, although I'll priobably end up stylising them a bit more.

I've added an indication of how I envisage the archers to work - 1 way bombardments from the Norman line.
The line of Housecarls (the Sacon front line) is going to be fairly impenetratable - in keeping with how the battle really was. I'm undecided about how this could work; either have them unattackable (they broke down the left flank in the end; hence the lines), or with autodeploys, or with higher starting values, or a combination of both...

what is the significance of this battle? i'm just wondering for my own purposes. it looks like a cool idea though

Wkipedia is your friend.

this map is going to get confusing real fast. try to keep it in check please.

whitestazn88 wrote:what is the significance of this battle? i'm just wondering for my own purposes. it looks like a cool idea though

According to hearsay (not the pop group), 1066 is the most common PIN and alarm code in the UK...

Incandenza wrote:Wkipedia is your friend.

Wikipedia??
Wikipedia: Battle of Hastings

mibi wrote:this map is going to get confusing real fast. try to keep it in check please.

Thanks for the concern mibi. Clarity will be crucial, and will be easier to get right once I've got the structure sorted (ie once I've defined territories etc.)

The more I think about it, the more I think you could ace (or even break off into its own map) the North England / Stamford Bridge / Harald Hadrada part of the map, and just keep things focused on southern England, Normandy, and Hastings itself (assuming you've already determined not to do a straight-up battle map).

Benn maybe you got lost! Drafting room for you

[moved]

Nope - didn't get lost.... I started with the idea!

Thanks for moving me into the drafting room... I was about to PM you to ask!

not much to comment on right now... except that everything is to jumbled up!