Quickie Maf [Endgame] *Town VICTORy*

[evilchaos]

I would think a no lynch would be better than a speed lynch of a random player for no reason. Both are undesirable, though. I have next to no clue who the mafia is. =(

[Victor Sullivan]

I have shieldgenerator7 on the reserves list. I'll let you all decide what you want to do about Yoshi. I don't care either way.

-Sully

[Talapus]

I have shieldgenerator7 on the reserves list. I'll let you all decide what you want to do about Yoshi. I don't care either way.

-Sully

Ehhh, if Doom comes back by then, then I don't care about waiting. We don't seem to have much to go on yet or have a lot of discussion at the moment. Unless he's scum Sully, then you can do us all a favor and mod kill him

[Victor Sullivan]

You can vote him, but I won't be modkilling him


-Sully

[Fircoal]

I have shieldgenerator7 on the reserves list. I'll let you all decide what you want to do about Yoshi. I don't care either way.

-Sully

Ehhh, if Doom comes back by then, then I don't care about waiting. We don't seem to have much to go on yet or have a lot of discussion at the moment. Unless he's scum Sully, then you can do us all a favor and mod kill him

Tal is right, we don't have much to go on. Which means maybe we should vote a scumariner. Due to this type of setup a no lynch would be extremely stupid. Cause then we'd get 0 mislynches, which even if we lynch at random we'd get 1.

[kratos644]

Hmm. Deadline is tomorrow. I haven't seen Haggis or Rodion post anything really. What about lynching one of them?

[evilchaos]

Rodion and Haggis are the two that haven't posted in a long time. These are their last posts and times of those posts.

Vote Kratos because a monkey will never be as cool as a cow. And he's a monkey. And I'm a cow.

TIME: Sat May 14, 2011 11:24 pm

unvote vote yoshi because he's always scum, as per universal truth #38

TIME: Sun May 15, 2011 8:20 am

Out of the two, Rodion posted the least recent. He also only posted a total of one time since his confirmation post. His last post on the entirety of the forums was on Wed May 18, 2011 8:22 pm. Link is below:

viewtopic.php?f=213&t=143443&p=3173378#p3173378

If we want to vote for someone who's lurking, then I guess Rodion is the guy to go for. I don't really like basing a vote on that, though.

I may not be around tomorrow (going to an Awards Ceremony for being the best Math student in my county ), so I'll leave my vote on Rodion just in case you guys decide to go the route of lynching a lurker.

Unvote vote Rodion

[Rodion]

I've been prodded (everyone else was, actually).

I didn't talk much because I didn't want to waste my vast and almighty skills in this puny game! My power as an entity is obviously above this mortal game!

Seriously, there was joke voting and then people started making weaksauce cases out of nowhere. The scummiest thing I've seen was Talapus calling Yoshi out for his speed lynch joke, but that might have just been a misunderstanding. I don't know who's suspicious enough to get lynched, hence my submarining.

Now, if you don't mind, Your Excellency le Rodion has important stuff to do and will live you with your little game until you can find a decent case to warrant a vote!

[Rodion]

EBWOP:

"leave you with", not "live you with"

Everyone's incompetence is trying to contaminate Me of all people!

[Haggis_McMutton]

I have shieldgenerator7 on the reserves list. I'll let you all decide what you want to do about Yoshi. I don't care either way.

-Sully

Ehhh, if Doom comes back by then, then I don't care about waiting. We don't seem to have much to go on yet or have a lot of discussion at the moment. Unless he's scum Sully, then you can do us all a favor and mod kill him

Tal is right, we don't have much to go on. Which means maybe we should vote a scumariner. Due to this type of setup a no lynch would be extremely stupid. Cause then we'd get 0 mislynches, which even if we lynch at random we'd get 1.

True.

Due to this fact and the fact that there's no cases, i'll go with my gut and Vote Rodion

With a day before the deadline, he makes a post purely to stop people from waggoning him for lurking, but doesn't actually say anything that anybody could take issue with. Hides behind a joke to avoid even attempting to help town at all.

[evilchaos]

Rodion - why don't you help build cases instead of lurk until we do? That is a major scum tell in my opinion.

[Rodion]

Rodion - why don't you help build cases instead of lurk until we do? That is a major scum tell in my opinion.

Because there was not enough information to get a case built to begin with! All we had was people jokevoting, Yoshi making a speedlynch joke and Talapus calling him out on it. That's it! What kind of serious analysis can I do based on so few information?

I do have something now, though.

I have shieldgenerator7 on the reserves list. I'll let you all decide what you want to do about Yoshi. I don't care either way.

-Sully

Ehhh, if Doom comes back by then, then I don't care about waiting. We don't seem to have much to go on yet or have a lot of discussion at the moment. Unless he's scum Sully, then you can do us all a favor and mod kill him

Tal is right, we don't have much to go on. Which means maybe we should vote a scumariner. Due to this type of setup a no lynch would be extremely stupid. Cause then we'd get 0 mislynches, which even if we lynch at random we'd get 1.

True.

Due to this fact and the fact that there's no cases, i'll go with my gut and Vote Rodion

With a day before the deadline, he makes a post purely to stop people from waggoning him for lurking, but doesn't actually say anything that anybody could take issue with. Hides behind a joke to avoid even attempting to help town at all.

That's a great way of hiding a lack of reasoning, going with one's "gut". And you've got your facts wrong. I didn't wait to post until I had a vote on. I came here to say something because I got prodded. Just like YOU were. For the same reasons that I did, by the way (inactivity). It's pretty low that you are an inactive yourself and you hop on someone else's wagon partly due to inactivity.

Besides, you're bashing me for not saying anything "bashable"?

I can't believe how weak that reasoning is! You're trying to lynch the smartest player in the whole game with a strategy this poor?!
This is not going to work, little dude! Step up your game level or I'll be forced to fart in your general direction!

Vote Haggis.

Chaos, you should unvote me before I get speedlynched. With 2 mafia playing the game, bringing a vote count from 2 to 4 is something that can happen in a matter of minutes.

[Rodion]

EBWOP:

Unvote Kratos.
Vote Haggis.

The voice of wisdom, power, culture, sexiness and everything that is good has spoken.

[evilchaos]

I agree that Haggis sounds suspicious, and I'll point a major FoS his way, but what you did was just as suspicious in my opinion.

- All leads start somewhere, and they come from players slipping up in their posts. They often start during joke votes or half-serious discussions in between joke votes. Not posting at all (even just to say that you're still alive) makes it seem like you want to avoid a slip-up.

- Your vote for Haggis was basically an OMGUS vote. You are attacking him for poor reasoning behind his vote for you.

I want to leave my vote somewhere to keep a lynch possible as, statistically, the town is better off today lynching a person at random then performing a no lynch. I won't be here tomorrow, so I can't unvote and then reapply my vote if necessary. It's best left where it is at the moment.

[Haggis_McMutton]

Rodion - why don't you help build cases instead of lurk until we do? That is a major scum tell in my opinion.

Yep, it is. By not building cases he's not attracting attention to himself and not exposing himself. It suggests that he just wants to survive and doesn't give a damn about who is lynched.

Rodion - why don't you help build cases instead of lurk until we do? That is a major scum tell in my opinion.

Because there was not enough information to get a case built to begin with! All we had was people jokevoting, Yoshi making a speedlynch joke and Talapus calling him out on it. That's it! What kind of serious analysis can I do based on so few information?

Anything is better than nothing. You presented nothing, which only helps you, not the town.

I have shieldgenerator7 on the reserves list. I'll let you all decide what you want to do about Yoshi. I don't care either way.

-Sully

Ehhh, if Doom comes back by then, then I don't care about waiting. We don't seem to have much to go on yet or have a lot of discussion at the moment. Unless he's scum Sully, then you can do us all a favor and mod kill him

Tal is right, we don't have much to go on. Which means maybe we should vote a scumariner. Due to this type of setup a no lynch would be extremely stupid. Cause then we'd get 0 mislynches, which even if we lynch at random we'd get 1.

True.

Due to this fact and the fact that there's no cases, i'll go with my gut and Vote Rodion

With a day before the deadline, he makes a post purely to stop people from waggoning him for lurking, but doesn't actually say anything that anybody could take issue with. Hides behind a joke to avoid even attempting to help town at all.

That's a great way of hiding a lack of reasoning, going with one's "gut". And you've got your facts wrong. I didn't wait to post until I had a vote on. I came here to say something because I got prodded. Just like YOU were. For the same reasons that I did, by the way (inactivity). It's pretty low that you are an inactive yourself and you hop on someone else's wagon partly due to inactivity.

1. Misrepresentation. I didn't just say "gut". I explained the reasons.
2. WIFOM, how do I know you would have posted if a lynch wasn't being pushed on you?
3. You just said "I'm here guys, don't lynch", i presented a case that is now generating discussion. See the difference?

Besides, you're bashing me for not saying anything "bashable"?

I can't believe how weak that reasoning is! You're trying to lynch the smartest player in the whole game with a strategy this poor?!
This is not going to work, little dude! Step up your game level or I'll be forced to fart in your general direction!

Vote Haggis.

Chaos, you should unvote me before I get speedlynched. With 2 mafia playing the game, bringing a vote count from 2 to 4 is something that can happen in a matter of minutes.

I'm voting you because you're hiding behind jokes/PR's to avoid contributing anything to this game. A major scumtell.

[Rodion]

Haggis, your minuscule brain is probably confusing your thoughts. Or is it perhaps the awe of being in front of Me that cloudens thy judgement?

1 - Compare timestamps. They're of public knowledge (as Victor prodded everyone). You can see my post here came 9 minutes after the mass prod (11:28 pm to 11:37 pm brazilian time, but you'll also get the same 9 minutes regardless of timezone). You've got the courage to say I only posted because I had 1 vote on me?

2 - Prior to our post-prod posts, the only difference between you and me is that you got lucky. Lucky that your jokevote happened 9 hours after my jokevote, thus creating the illusion that my "inactivity" was bigger than yours and warranting Chaos' vote. Now you're using my answer to a prod as a defense to that one vote, which sounds more like going for the easy lynch rather than trying to build a case and getting your life on the line (which you just accused me of not doing).

[Haggis_McMutton]

Haggis, your minuscule brain is probably confusing your thoughts. Or is it perhaps the awe of being in front of Me that cloudens thy judgement?

1 - Compare timestamps. They're of public knowledge (as Victor prodded everyone). You can see my post here came 9 minutes after the mass prod (11:28 pm to 11:37 pm brazilian time, but you'll also get the same 9 minutes regardless of timezone). You've got the courage to say I only posted because I had 1 vote on me?

1. Misrepresentation #2. It wasn't "just one vote". it was 3 people that we're talking about lynching an inactive and one guy pointing out that the inactive to be lynched should be you. With this small of a game, this close to the deadline, you not speaking up would basically guarantee your death.

2. Bad logic. The prod only caused you to look at the thread. If the situation was different and your head wasn't on the chopping block you could have easily abstained from posting. There is no way to discern if the prod or your imminent demise was your primary cause for posting.
Furthermore, since your post was basically "I'm here, don't lynch me", it doesn't seem like you were really interested in anything but stopping your lynch.

You're accumulating quite a pile of misleading statements here. One has to wonder if a man of your caliber might make so many honest mistakes or if he might be trying to manipulate the town.

2 - Prior to our post-prod posts, the only difference between you and me is that you got lucky. Lucky that your jokevote happened 9 hours after my jokevote, thus creating the illusion that my "inactivity" was bigger than yours and warranting Chaos' vote. Now you're using my answer to a prod as a defense to that one vote, which sounds more like going for the easy lynch rather than trying to build a case and getting your life on the line (which you just accused me of not doing).

Yep, that was the difference then, things have changed though.
I'm not using your answer to the prod as a defense, I'm using it as an offense, to get you lynched namely.

Now, explain to me which of our two answers to the prod would imply that the poster is more interested in self-preservation?
You saying nothing that can cause a stir and basically trying to doom the town to a no lynch/ random lynch(as long as it ain't you). Or the guy who put his neck out, earning a vote and a FOS in the process, but has managed to produce some discussion and move this game past the joke vote stage?

[Talapus]

2. Bad logic. The prod only caused you to look at the thread. If the situation was different and your head wasn't on the chopping block you could have easily abstained from posting. There is no way to discern if the prod or your imminent demise was your primary cause for posting.
Furthermore, since your post was basically "I'm here, don't lynch me", it doesn't seem like you were really interested in anything but stopping your lynch.

You're accumulating quite a pile of misleading statements here. One has to wonder if a man of your caliber might make so many honest mistakes or if he might be trying to manipulate the town.

I actually have to agree with Haggis here on this one. Rodion was rather active in other threads during his multi day abstaining from this thread. But Haggis was also abstaining from this thread. Howevre Rodion seems to have an extremely high opinion of himself and keeps mentioning how much better he is then the rest of us which just oozes scummy sarcastic charm. This day is coming to a close and honestly I'd be more willing right now to vote Rod over Haggs, but that would put you at lynch -1 and if you aren't scum, that would give scum the chance to hammer. We all know the chu is hammer happy and has he hasn't posted recently, I wouldn't want to potentially lose a town because the chu didn't want to read the thread before casting a vote with the rest of us. I will place to vote though closer to the deadline in hopes of avoiding a quick, preclaim, lynch.

[Rodion]

You're lost. It was a nice maneuver, Haggis, I must admit, but you wasted it on a game that has Me of all people! And I can diagnose it and show it to the world. Because, yes, I'm THAT good.

Haggis, your minuscule brain is probably confusing your thoughts. Or is it perhaps the awe of being in front of Me that cloudens thy judgement?

1 - Compare timestamps. They're of public knowledge (as Victor prodded everyone). You can see my post here came 9 minutes after the mass prod (11:28 pm to 11:37 pm brazilian time, but you'll also get the same 9 minutes regardless of timezone). You've got the courage to say I only posted because I had 1 vote on me?

1. Misrepresentation #2. It wasn't "just one vote". it was 3 people that we're talking about lynching an inactive and one guy pointing out that the inactive to be lynched should be you. With this small of a game, this close to the deadline, you not speaking up would basically guarantee your death.

2. Bad logic. The prod only caused you to look at the thread. If the situation was different and your head wasn't on the chopping block you could have easily abstained from posting. There is no way to discern if the prod or your imminent demise was your primary cause for posting.
Furthermore, since your post was basically "I'm here, don't lynch me", it doesn't seem like you were really interested in anything but stopping your lynch.
You're accumulating quite a pile of misleading statements here. One has to wonder if a man of your caliber might make so many honest mistakes or if he might be trying to manipulate the town.

2 - Prior to our post-prod posts, the only difference between you and me is that you got lucky. Lucky that your jokevote happened 9 hours after my jokevote, thus creating the illusion that my "inactivity" was bigger than yours and warranting Chaos' vote. Now you're using my answer to a prod as a defense to that one vote, which sounds more like going for the easy lynch rather than trying to build a case and getting your life on the line (which you just accused me of not doing).

Yep, that was the difference then, things have changed though.
I'm not using your answer to the prod as a defense, I'm using it as an offense, to get you lynched namely.

What about you, Haggis? Town was trying to get an inactive lynched. There were 2 people considered inactives (you and me). I posted. You were the only inactive left. The targeting would then default to you (the last inactive remaining) and that's exactly when you decided to interrupt your self-imposed hiatus to land a vote on someone that already had 1 vote (me), a vote which was sort of set in stone as Chaos' said he wouldn't have time to change it. And that is exactly the reason why I called your case a defensive one, not offensive as you're trying to make it look. Because you foresaw that your head would be next in line for a lynch and then you posted against the person that was currently under scrutiny so the torch wouldn't be passed to you.

Now, explain to me which of our two answers to the prod would imply that the poster is more interested in self-preservation?
You saying nothing that can cause a stir and basically trying to doom the town to a no lynch/ random lynch(as long as it ain't you). Or the guy who put his neck out, earning a vote and a FOS in the process, but has managed to produce some discussion and move this game past the joke vote stage?

I'm not more interested in "self-preservation", but self-preservation is undeniably a means towards the end of winning the game.
Check this (I'll use approximate values):
Random lynch - 71% kills town, 29% kills mafia
Random lynch as "as long as it ain't me" = 67% kills town, 33% kills mafia
Lynch me - 100% kills town

And, wait a second! You can only try to get away with your attack if you really see yourself as "putting your neck out". As I said, you only did that at the moment you'd become the target. That means you didn't put your neck out at all, you were merely trying to hide!

[Haggis_McMutton]

Interesting. You've quit trying to defend yourself and have instead gone on the offensive. Running out of arguments?
I'm glad you're not disputing your use of bad logic and attempts to mislead the town though.

What about you, Haggis? Town was trying to get an inactive lynched. There were 2 people considered inactives (you and me). I posted. You were the only inactive left. The targeting would then default to you (the last inactive remaining) and that's exactly when you decided to interrupt your self-imposed hiatus to land a vote on someone that already had 1 vote (me), a vote which was sort of set in stone as Chaos' said he wouldn't have time to change it. And that is exactly the reason why I called your case a defensive one, not offensive as you're trying to make it look. Because you foresaw that your head would be next in line for a lynch and then you posted against the person that was currently under scrutiny so the torch wouldn't be passed to you.

So you're accusing me of exactly the thing you're being accused of? Namely trying only to save your skin?
Yes, it's been established that both of us posted when we were in danger of being lynched. Your post however was "I'm here, don't lynch me", while my post has generated the only non-joke discussion in the game so far.
Which one of these has benefited the town more?

The intentions behind my post are WIFOM. I claim that I find you to be the best case. You claim I'm trying to save my neck. No way to prove it one way or another.

I'm not more interested in "self-preservation", but self-preservation is undeniably a means towards the end of winning the game.
Check this (I'll use approximate values):
Random lynch - 71% kills town, 29% kills mafia
Random lynch as "as long as it ain't me" = 67% kills town, 33% kills mafia
Lynch me - 100% kills town

Now, do the statistics on town winning if the townies are aggressively trying to find leads and cases while disregarding wether they become targets or not vs townies who first and foremost want to make sure they survive.

And, wait a second! You can only try to get away with your attack if you really see yourself as "putting your neck out". As I said, you only did that at the moment you'd become the target. That means you didn't put your neck out at all, you were merely trying to hide!

Ah, a rehash of the WIFOM argument, for good measure.

Again, one has to wonder if a distinguished man such as yourself would know better than to push such a poor argument.

[evilchaos]

What about you, Haggis? Town was trying to get an inactive lynched. There were 2 people considered inactives (you and me). I posted. You were the only inactive left. The targeting would then default to you (the last inactive remaining) and that's exactly when you decided to interrupt your self-imposed hiatus to land a vote on someone that already had 1 vote (me), a vote which was sort of set in stone as Chaos' said he wouldn't have time to change it. And that is exactly the reason why I called your case a defensive one, not offensive as you're trying to make it look. Because you foresaw that your head would be next in line for a lynch and then you posted against the person that was currently under scrutiny so the torch wouldn't be passed to you.

You didn't post until you were prodded. Haggis didn't either. He was no more inactive then you were. You're the one that's sounded scummy since then. You've basically said since deciding to come back to the thread that you are too good to be involved in the joke voting stage, which is the start of any Mafia game. This shows one of two things. Either you're incredibly arrogant or scum. I'm leaning towards scum, but either way, I won't be too sad to see you lynched. Arrogance doesn't help win the game, discussion and developing claims does.

[Rodion]

Interesting. You've quit trying to defend yourself and have instead gone on the offensive. Running out of arguments?
I'm glad you're not disputing your use of bad logic and attempts to mislead the town though.

That's a nice way of trying to dominate a discussion, by narrating the facts from your own perspective. And there were not attempts at misleading or use of bad logic, I just don't want to play the "he said she said" game. You're saying my defense for posting after the prod is WIFOM. Your attack for my posting after the prod is equally WIFOM. That part you didn't narrate, I wonder why?[/quote]

What about you, Haggis? Town was trying to get an inactive lynched. There were 2 people considered inactives (you and me). I posted. You were the only inactive left. The targeting would then default to you (the last inactive remaining) and that's exactly when you decided to interrupt your self-imposed hiatus to land a vote on someone that already had 1 vote (me), a vote which was sort of set in stone as Chaos' said he wouldn't have time to change it. And that is exactly the reason why I called your case a defensive one, not offensive as you're trying to make it look. Because you foresaw that your head would be next in line for a lynch and then you posted against the person that was currently under scrutiny so the torch wouldn't be passed to you.

So you're accusing me of exactly the thing you're being accused of? Namely trying only to save your skin?
Yes, it's been established that both of us posted when we were in danger of being lynched. Your post however was "I'm here, don't lynch me", while my post has generated the only non-joke discussion in the game so far.
Which one of these has benefited the town more?

There's a difference here. I tried to save my skin without trying to frame anyone because I didn't feel there was someone scummy enough at the moment. You're randomly throwing spurious accusations on me in order to save yours.

And regarding what benefited the town more, jury's still out on that. If I'm forced to claim, my approach definitely benefited the town more. If I'm lynched, then my approach definitely benefited the town more. You merely got the ball rolling (props to you for that) and you can't use that as an alibi.

The intentions behind my post are WIFOM. I claim that I find you to be the best case. You claim I'm trying to save my neck. No way to prove it one way or another.

I'm not more interested in "self-preservation", but self-preservation is undeniably a means towards the end of winning the game.
Check this (I'll use approximate values):
Random lynch - 71% kills town, 29% kills mafia
Random lynch as "as long as it ain't me" = 67% kills town, 33% kills mafia
Lynch me - 100% kills town

Now, do the statistics on town winning if the townies are aggressively trying to find leads and cases while disregarding wether they become targets or not vs townies who first and foremost want to make sure they survive.

Agressiveness can be blinding. It's a double-edged blade.

And, wait a second! You can only try to get away with your attack if you really see yourself as "putting your neck out". As I said, you only did that at the moment you'd become the target. That means you didn't put your neck out at all, you were merely trying to hide!

Ah, a rehash of the WIFOM argument, for good measure.

Again, one has to wonder if a distinguished man such as yourself would know better than to push such a poor argument.

My argument is not poorer than yours. Here's what you did so far:

a) preemptively attacking me before you got under scrutiny
b) throwing WIFOM accusations on me (you couldn't accuse anyone otherwise, as there was only jokevoting up to now)
c) calling me out for using WIFOM on you

Oh, yes, I almost forgot. Your inferiority amazes me! They should probably make 2 different mafia forums here, one for me and one for the rest of the "commoners". Now THAT would be fair!

[Victor Sullivan]

Vote Count

DoomYoshi (1)- Talapus
Fircoal (1)- DoomYoshi
Rodion (2)- evilchaos, Haggis L-2
Haggis (1)- Rodion

Deadline is whenever I get back from my hang out with an old friend Remember, a no lynch will occur if a majority is not reached!

-Sully

[Talapus]

Oh, yes, I almost forgot. Your inferiority amazes me! They should probably make 2 different mafia forums here, one for me and one for the rest of the "commoners". Now THAT would be fair!

So we've reached the stage of insulting the rest of us huh? Thats it for me.

Unvote: If Needed[/b
][b]Vote: Rodion

[Victor Sullivan]

After some bickering, and to the dismay of the deceased's father, the seven were unable to reach a decision before the night drifted swiftly upon the town...

NIGHT ONE COMMENCE

I'll allow 72 hours for this night, and I'll end it earlier if everyone gets their actions in before then.

-Sully