M:tG Planeswalker mafia - Town wins!

[edocsil]

UNVOTE VOTE SULLY.

I really shouldn't talk so much and then not follow through.

[Iron Butterfly]

I was not dismissive.

You said there was still a cop. I asked if you where joking.

Pretty simple really. This is a game of lying. When I see a statement like your cop one ...everything that follows is suspect whether you are sincere or not.

Gah, there you go, ignoring the entire point of my argument. This is about argument and counter argument not lets see how much dirt we can throw at each other to discredit the other guys.

That's weak ground you're standing on, edoc. That's purely, oh, what is the term...meta, logic.

Do you suppose mafia have fake role claims as well?

-Sully

.... you aren't helping much here although I can't say I particularly blame you

I would say that in 90% of games there are fakes, although some are better then others. however I don't really see the relevance. Meta is important too, people typically do not act out of character or break from the norm.

I am not throwing dirt. I was pointing out the obvious about your cop statement. I try and take nothing for granted.
Yes you have more Mafia experience then myself and are more knowlageble about their set up. I can easily concede that.

Before I vote..I wish to hear from Sheep on why he needed to claim.

[jgordon1111]

Exactly,something is wrong here with both claiming and especially in light of edoc's statement that it is to small a game to have a cop a tracker and a watcher,if edoc is correct about game size and coresponding role types.So with that in mind sorry sully but one more time so the noob has it down,and if you dont mind you also sheep say again what you were about in the night and why. Just humor me please

[pancakemix]

Unvote vote sheep

Judging by flavor, Garruk Wildspeaker makes perfect sense as a tracker. Tezzeret makes no sense as a watcher. He's kind of an ass. To everybody. Not only that, but he's a member of the Infinite Consortium that killed Jace. And is trying to take it over. My theory is that you're a mafia usurper who has an elaborate plan but you took a foolish gamble. Or worse, you're just making a bad fake claim

I saw no confirmation or denial of sheep's claim from Iron Butterfly. He must claim NOW because the number of roles he could be are very few, and he had better have a good reason for targeting himself.

Make no mistake, Tezzeret is a bad guy. A very bad one at that.

[edocsil]

Unvote vote sheep

Judging by flavor, Garruk Wildspeaker makes perfect sense as a tracker. Tezzeret makes no sense as a watcher. He's kind of an ass. To everybody. Not only that, but he's a member of the Infinite Consortium that killed Jace. And is trying to take it over. My theory is that you're a mafia usurper who has an elaborate plan but you took a foolish gamble. Or worse, you're just making a bad fake claim

I saw no confirmation or denial of sheep's claim from Iron Butterfly. He must claim NOW because the number of roles he could be are very few, and he had better have a good reason for targeting himself.

Make no mistake, Tezzeret is a bad guy. A very bad one at that.

Unvote due to flavor spec. Ill post more later tonight after I finish homework and read up on flavor.

Also, to anyone who goes along with my three investigative theory, remember it is not iron clad, it just says that this is a very unlikely scenario. Just think things trough before you act.

[jgordon1111]

Went back through some other games,havent found one yet with that trio,going to look at some bigger games to see,but unless slow did it on purpose as a twist then its not looking likely. It was a worthwhile point to think about and look into.

[Iron Butterfly]

Unvote vote sheep

Judging by flavor, Garruk Wildspeaker makes perfect sense as a tracker. Tezzeret makes no sense as a watcher. He's kind of an ass. To everybody. Not only that, but he's a member of the Infinite Consortium that killed Jace. And is trying to take it over. My theory is that you're a mafia usurper who has an elaborate plan but you took a foolish gamble. Or worse, you're just making a bad fake claim

I saw no confirmation or denial of sheep's claim from Iron Butterfly. He must claim NOW because the number of roles he could be are very few, and he had better have a good reason for targeting himself.

Make no mistake, Tezzeret is a bad guy. A very bad one at that.

First your observation is astute. I havnt payed MTG since around Ice Age so I didnt give the present lore the attention it may have need for our game.

freezie was Sarkahn Vol a very warlike power hungry battle mage. He had an interesting and manipultive relation ship with Tezzeret the Seeker. The flavor of those two make sense in them being Mafia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planeswalker

PCM is correct I targeted myself. First all you need to do is read the first day to understand why I did so and put yourself in my place with the roles availiable. I am not going to Claim my role and make it easier for Mafia. If I was Mafia what would it benifit me or my team to target myself? PCM could easily be a mafia watcher as well.

Second if PCM is Mafia and playing a gambit he kills Sully, which could leave 4 town dead and 3 town claimed. Three people died the first night. Freezie may have gotten killed targeting someone so I assume may be know who that may be? We have either a SK or Mafia JOAT? And Mafia night kill action.

If Town loses 2 more we are in deep poop. Add to the fact that we have players not playing..SG7, RDS2012 and Drake are all missing in action or sublurking.

the point is there is alot to be gained for Mafia if we lynch a Town and they get 2 more kills in the evening.

[sheepofdumb]

Unvote vote sheep

Judging by flavor, Garruk Wildspeaker makes perfect sense as a tracker. Tezzeret makes no sense as a watcher. He's kind of an ass. To everybody. Not only that, but he's a member of the Infinite Consortium that killed Jace. And is trying to take it over. My theory is that you're a mafia usurper who has an elaborate plan but you took a foolish gamble. Or worse, you're just making a bad fake claim

I saw no confirmation or denial of sheep's claim from Iron Butterfly. He must claim NOW because the number of roles he could be are very few, and he had better have a good reason for targeting himself.

Make no mistake, Tezzeret is a bad guy. A very bad one at that.

I'm not going to argue over lore. I've tried to argue using lore before and have been proven wrong.

[Iron Butterfly]

Unvote vote sheep

Judging by flavor, Garruk Wildspeaker makes perfect sense as a tracker. Tezzeret makes no sense as a watcher. He's kind of an ass. To everybody. Not only that, but he's a member of the Infinite Consortium that killed Jace. And is trying to take it over. My theory is that you're a mafia usurper who has an elaborate plan but you took a foolish gamble. Or worse, you're just making a bad fake claim

I saw no confirmation or denial of sheep's claim from Iron Butterfly. He must claim NOW because the number of roles he could be are very few, and he had better have a good reason for targeting himself.

Make no mistake, Tezzeret is a bad guy. A very bad one at that.

First your observation is astute. I havnt payed MTG since around Ice Age so I didnt give the present lore the attention it may have need for our game.

freezie was Sarkahn Vol a very warlike power hungry battle mage. He had an interesting and manipultive relation ship with Tezzeret the Seeker. The flavor of those two make sense in them being Mafia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Planeswalker

PCM is correct I targeted myself. First all you need to do is read the first day to understand why I did so and put yourself in my place with the roles availiable. I am not going to Claim my role and make it easier for Mafia. If I was Mafia what would it benifit me or my team to target myself? PCM could easily be a mafia watcher as well.

Second if PCM is Mafia and playing a gambit he kills Sully, which could leave 4 town dead and 3 town claimed. Three people died the first night. Freezie may have gotten killed targeting someone so I assume may be know who that may be? We have either a SK or Mafia JOAT? And Mafia night kill action.

If Town loses 2 more we are in deep poop. Add to the fact that we have players not playing..SG7, RDS2012 and Drake are all missing in action or sublurking.

the point is there is alot to be gained for Mafia if we lynch a Town and they get 2 more kills in the evening.

After I say PCM the first time sudstitute Sheeps name for PCM. Sorry for the confusion.

[slowreactor]

Vote Count:

Victor Sullivan (3) - Iliad, jgordon1111, sheepofdumb
Iliad (1) - wildwilliam
sheepofdumb (1) - pancakemix

With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch.

Would you guys like me to send a mass prod?

[pancakemix]

Vote Count:

Victor Sullivan (3) - Iliad, jgordon1111, sheepofdumb
Iliad (1) - wildwilliam
sheepofdumb (1) - pancakemix

With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch.

Would you guys like me to send a mass prod?

You don't have to constantly send mass prods. We've got some good discussion going now, and I don't want my inbox crowded because I'm active. Pick and choose who you prod. It makes it easier to figure out who needs replaced.

[Iron Butterfly]

Interesting how Drake is "to busy" to post in our game and yet finds time for a heated debate in another Mafia game.

A prod is not needed for him. Hes around, he just chooses not to post this game.

[Iron Butterfly]

Vote Sully

We can do the WIFOM dance forever.

I slept on it. I will say that Sheep supplied the correct info in that I targeted myself last night. Do we judge him on the flavor of his card? I dont think so.

[slowreactor]

Vote Count:

Victor Sullivan (3) - Iliad, jgordon1111, sheepofdumb
Iliad (1) - wildwilliam
sheepofdumb (1) - pancakemix

With 11 alive it takes 6 to lynch.

Would you guys like me to send a mass prod?

You don't have to constantly send mass prods. We've got some good discussion going now, and I don't want my inbox crowded because I'm active. Pick and choose who you prod. It makes it easier to figure out who needs replaced.

Very well, done

[pancakemix]

Vote Sully

We can do the WIFOM dance forever.

I slept on it. I will say that Sheep supplied the correct info in that I targeted myself last night. Do we judge him on the flavor of his card? I dont think so.

Why not? He completely copped out on it. Also, there are zero plus sides to him outing himself and not actually counterclaiming Victor. In any way, shape, or form.

That's the real problem with sheep's claim: it means shit. Edoc THEORIZED that three investigatives is unlikely, and in theory that's probably true. He admitted, however, that it's not a certainty. You're just trying to move on here without regard for the evidence (remember, that's why Sully is where he is).

Keep in mind here: your fate is now tied to sheep's. If he's lying, you're in hot water. He could know your role because he watched you or he could know because you're scummates. He could be lying and you didn't go anywhere, or you went somewhere else. That's why I asked for a claim: because you can corroborate his story, prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that he's telling the truth by claiming.

Instead, you're saying "let's not talk about it". Instead you're saying "let's just move on". Instead you're saying "don't ask questions".

That's incredibly scummy. And I won't stand for it.

[shieldgenerator7]

here! just finished page 23. Have about half an hour to read up. If I can do that, I'll post again today. If not, I'll have to post later.

So rodion was jailkeeper after all...

From page 23, VOTE VS

Because his quick hammer seemed scummy.

-SG7 ( )

[Victor Sullivan]

here! just finished page 23. Have about half an hour to read up. If I can do that, I'll post again today. If not, I'll have to post later.

So rodion was jailkeeper after all...

From page 23, VOTE VS

Because his quick hammer seemed scummy.

-SG7 ( )

*Sigh* You really need to read up fully before voting. I've been background checked and verified (I never even thought to do that )

-Sully

[shieldgenerator7]

here! just finished page 23. Have about half an hour to read up. If I can do that, I'll post again today. If not, I'll have to post later.

So rodion was jailkeeper after all...

From page 23, VOTE VS

Because his quick hammer seemed scummy.

-SG7 ( )

*Sigh* You really need to read up fully before voting. I've been background checked and verified (I never even thought to do that )

-Sully

Ok! read-uP! UNVOTE Sorry Sully, it just seemed necessary. Anyway, I find it very interesting about the sheep-iron thing.

[shieldgenerator7]

Sorry for double-post, didn't want anyone to hammer while I was writing my thoughts. Sheep claims iron targeted himslef last night, and iron affirms it. OF course it woudln't make sense for mafia to target himslef, unless he's mafia doc, which would make sense. Then again, sheep might just be claiming to target his scummate and iron confirms it to keep his scummate alive. This means iron probably targeted someone else last night. So (1) I think sheep should die in light of flavor spec, I haven't researched it myself, but I believe edoc, and (2) I want a claim from iron, mostly because sheep's counter claim is questionable. But I think if sheep turns up scum, then iron is more than likely to be scum as well. So, VOTE SHEEP

Rally together, brethren! We will rule this land, Zodakbar, or whatever it was called...! Zodakar?

-SG7 ( )

[Iron Butterfly]

Vote Sully

We can do the WIFOM dance forever.

I slept on it. I will say that Sheep supplied the correct info in that I targeted myself last night. Do we judge him on the flavor of his card? I dont think so.

Why not? He completely copped out on it. Also, there are zero plus sides to him outing himself and not actually counterclaiming Victor. In any way, shape, or form.

That's the real problem with sheep's claim: it means shit. Edoc THEORIZED that three investigatives is unlikely, and in theory that's probably true. He admitted, however, that it's not a certainty. You're just trying to move on here without regard for the evidence (remember, that's why Sully is where he is).

Keep in mind here: your fate is now tied to sheep's. If he's lying, you're in hot water. He could know your role because he watched you or he could know because you're scummates. He could be lying and you didn't go anywhere, or you went somewhere else. That's why I asked for a claim: because you can corroborate his story, prove beyond a shadow of a doubt that he's telling the truth by claiming.

Instead, you're saying "let's not talk about it". Instead you're saying "let's just move on". Instead you're saying "don't ask questions".

That's incredibly scummy. And I won't stand for it.

Im through fighting Sullys battle. If he wants to live he better put a tad more effort into it.

[pancakemix]

Im through fighting Sullys battle. If he wants to live he better put a tad more effort into it.

You didn't even read my fucking post, did you? You're not fighting Sully's battle. You're fighting YOURS. You're just as involved as he is in this. You can either claim and settle the matter or we can lynch you after we find out the truth for ourselves.

Odd that neither you or sheep is trying to argue the point here...

[Iron Butterfly]

Im through fighting Sullys battle. If he wants to live he better put a tad more effort into it.

You didn't even read my fucking post, did you? You're not fighting Sully's battle. You're fighting YOURS. You're just as involved as he is in this. You can either claim and settle the matter or we can lynch you after we find out the truth for ourselves.

Odd that neither you or sheep is trying to argue the point here...

I did.

I have made my choice. I vote Sully.

You want to lynch me after the fact then go ahead.

"It will be inevetiable that Mafia can stand back as Town eats itself alive." Read that on wicki.

You want sheep to adress your questions. Then asj him.

[jgordon1111]

UNVOTE SULLYhave caught up some myself,Iron a simple question then,why did you target yourself,why did you feel it was neccessary considering how the vote went,I understand someone (linked you to rodion) but even at that it was pretty evident he was town.Therefore your (link) was like a blanket.who did you figure would target you?

[wildwilliam]

I see no reason for the voting on Victor.

Vote sheep

[Iron Butterfly]

You are Karn – town bus driver. You are a powerful golem able to manipulate space and time. However, your pacifism prevents you from harming any beings directly, so you instead protect them.


Click image to enlarge.


As a busdriver, you can choose to switch two players each night. Any night action performed on a switched player will affect the other player instead. You win when all threats to town have been eliminated.

Seeing how this is inevetiable.

I targeted myself because there was no reason not to. There was no one whom I trusted as Town so I switched places with someone I thought was a good canidate for elimination. I could have just as easily been targeted as Doom or Tail. I received no notice or PM that my night action was succesful.

I have resisted to fully reveal because it would still make it hard for Mafia to know my role.

Sheep you need to explain why you claimed and dragged me out with you. What was your logic...