The Murder Of Albarezzi- End Game- Mafia Wins!

[edocsil]

Not the target you are thinking however. Leave the whole nark and drab thing to me and Vic. I just pray that the docs prevent us from getting killed.

As for balance, we were told there was a SK in the flavor so we know she is there. There should be 3 scum with the kind of power the town supposedly is carrying. I have never seen a 2 man scum team in a game with more then 8 players

Fair enough, although, IMO, if that's indeed your plan, it would probably be smart to use both of those on the same one. For example, if Anark is GF and you will investigate him and track Drabod, you may not very good results and vice versa. If you'd do the same thing and they're scum, you'll get one good result from either of our roles (If it's GF, tracker will show the kill, if it's a mafia goon, cop will show scum).

Only problem is, there's only 1 confirmed doc and supposedly 1 JOAT with as yet unknown options. And me, but edoc seems reluctant to let me help...

Just don't switch me with one of the people on the kill list and don't target Anark.

[spiesr]

Fair enough, although, IMO, if that's indeed your plan, it would probably be smart to use both of those on the same one. For example, if Anark is GF and you will investigate him and track Drabod, you may not very good results and vice versa. If you'd do the same thing and they're scum, you'll get one good result from either of our roles (If it's GF, tracker will show the kill, if it's a mafia goon, cop will show scum).

I am not so sure that using both actions on the same person is as foolproof as you think it is. For example what if that person is the godfather and doesn't perform the kill himself. The exact mechanics of tracking (or roleblocking or whatever) individual mafia members may vary somewhat from mod to mod. However, I would assume the the act of performing the kill is assigned to one member, and therefor if you don't track the right guy you get nothing. What I am trying to say, is that if both action were to be aimed at the godfather, they could both very well not turn up anything. This point is kind of rendered moot though by AD's claim that he will kill people tonight. So the tracker would point to a dead person if we is scum, or if he is telling the truth.

[Anarkistsdream]

Right. Tracking me is pointless, since I AM going to go after someone, someone that you all have agreed upon must die.

Investigate drabod, though. At least that will prove his innocence and we can move on.

[pancakemix]

I am not so sure that using both actions on the same person is as foolproof as you think it is. For example what if that person is the godfather and doesn't perform the kill himself. The exact mechanics of tracking (or roleblocking or whatever) individual mafia members may vary somewhat from mod to mod. However, I would assume the the act of performing the kill is assigned to one member, and therefor if you don't track the right guy you get nothing. What I am trying to say, is that if both action were to be aimed at the godfather, they could both very well not turn up anything. This point is kind of rendered moot though by AD's claim that he will kill people tonight. So the tracker would point to a dead person if we is scum, or if he is telling the truth.

My thoughts exactly. We're in a scenario where if we conduct an investigation on Nark, even with both of those powers working at once, it may not be possible to get conclusive results. However, if we lynch him today, we'll still have Drabod for the night (if he's telling the truth about the lover thing, which is the only part of his claim I believe) and we can use the investigations on people who have yet to claim.

Right. Tracking me is pointless, since I AM going to go after someone, someone that you all have agreed upon must die.

Investigate drabod, though. At least that will prove his innocence and we can move on.

This will solve nothing because he could very well be town and you could be scum, even if you are lovers.

I agree with Vio in that I question the balance issues that would arise with both mafia and SK. If what Nark says is true, then having two town power roles lover linked with only 1 doctor and two nightkills in an 11 player game makes it much more likely that town loses two power roles relatively quickly. I'm not buying that we have 2 anti-town factions either.

Why is this against 2 factions and not against Nark? It's been the case against Nark the whole time. And if Nark lives, then there are 3 NKs (potential 4 with Drabod)? That makes no sense.

Back to voting an unclaimed, I think that's just setting us down a path of having a mass claim on Day 1. On top of that, I don't think there's enough reason to vote for /. "Contributing the least" isn't really a justification, and he's done as much or more than some people. If we MUST vote an unclaimed, I'd prefer it be Violet, mostly based on my role's hint, but I still think she's been scummy all game and probably contributed about as much as /. That said, I still contend that the Nark lynch is the best option.

[Anarkistsdream]

You realize that if you are still on my lynch and you are town, you are helping scum.

And if, as you all keep saying, Drabod is town and I am scum, than by lynching me, you are STILL killing off a very powerful town role. As it stands, by lynching me, you will kill off possibly the two MOST powerful townies, because we can talk at night, as well as in the day time, and I am vig and he is JOAT.

I truly wonder how many of you that keep pushing for my lynch is actually town, because I'm betting a few of you are not.

Our best bet is to lynch someone that YOU ALL agree on. Then, you guys need to also agree who I am to kill.

I'm gonna unvote for now, until you all come to an agreement. Since all of you started this against me and my hammering of Yoshi- which, as we found out, wasn't hammer- I'll just hammer again.

[/]

Gosh, freaking excuse me for not being here 15 hours every day to hop on the 3 bandwagons you all run every 7 hours. If taking the occasional day off of CC bothers you all so much I will request my replacement at your requests.

Drabod wisely already tried to throw AD under the bus once, I don't believe there is any chance he is AD's lover. But AD's actions have but him in a terrible spot, there is little doubt they are scum buddies, this is as clear cut as can be IMO,
Person A Claims Bomb when under pressure, "lol, you will die if you try to hurt me."
Person B calls it as a crap lie as the pressure continues and insists person A is killed
Person A "admits" that he doesn't want to die because he is a vig AND the lifeline of the JOAT
Person B unvotes because he believes this new revelation
....
Person B is Person A's JOAT lover

If this the kind of self preservation that comes with being a powerful 4 ability super townie connected to the town vig, then I really doubt drabod is going to be the most useful "MOST powerful townie" player this game.
Since my theories on the number of killers encouraged a bit of thought last time, I'll ponder a bit more for the other side
We have a cop
We have a doc
Every player seems to be a power role
We have 11 players
Why would we be given a JOAT in a game with 4 more people than a basic C9? (which has 7 players and 3-5 vanillas)
do those extra 4 people justify 4/11ths of the game being insta cleared? we already have one connected group, with the cop and tracker no less, is it likely the "vig and JOAT" are in the game and a group too? Town has three kills per round with no chance of hurting each other?


This is classic scum-buddy busing, plus his repeated statements that basically add up to "I don't give a crap, I'll kill anyone, you choose"

Even if we don't want to kill anyone

So, if we go no lynch, who do I target tonight?

As long as he gets to make a kill

since I AM going to go after someone, someone that you all have agreed upon must die.

he doesn't even want to get involved in the lynch, but someone, anyone must die

I'm gonna unvote for now, until you all come to an agreement. Since all of you started this against me and my hammering of Yoshi- which, as we found out, wasn't hammer- I'll just hammer again.

So, the people who are leading the way in this game are probably scum and helping scum, but should decide each and every move you make for you?
Vote AD

[Anarkistsdream]

You were fine until you made the last sentence...

So, the people who are leading the way in this game are probably scum and helping scum, but should decide each and every move you make for you?

That makes no sense whatsoever. Obviously there are more townies than scum, so listening to the consensus is still- most likely- listening to town.

Another person pushing for my lynch when it's easy, since they are under so much scrutiny themselves.

[edocsil]

You were fine until you made the last sentence...

So, the people who are leading the way in this game are probably scum and helping scum, but should decide each and every move you make for you?

That makes no sense whatsoever. Obviously there are more townies than scum, so listening to the consensus is still- most likely- listening to town.

Another person pushing for my lynch when it's easy, since they are under so much scrutiny themselves.

Yea, I don't care for that logic at all either. I was contemplating going for Vio instead, but not any more. I think as a rule the town should realize that hanging your potential salvation is a bad idea. It also is a decent way to balance a powerful group by making them lovers. I call / desperate and trying to hang the town power.

[pancakemix]

You were fine until you made the first sentence...

You were fine until you made the last sentence...

Are you acknowledging that /'s post is good? That there is actually good logic in there? That your claim doesn't make a lick of sense? That we should lynch you?

And if, as you all keep saying, Drabod is town and I am scum, than by lynching me, you are STILL killing off a very powerful town role. As it stands, by lynching me, you will kill off possibly the two MOST powerful townies, because we can talk at night, as well as in the day time, and I am vig and he is JOAT.

I am aware of that. But IMO a scum for a townie is a good trade. Especially a townie who hasn't contributed much.

And the more you repeat it, the less believable your claim is. Lemme put this in perspective for all of you out in Internetland: Two powerful town roles which can both kill in an 11 player game are linked by love and can coordinate their moves. Really, think about this. Does this sound balanced at all in a game of this size? Add to this the fact that he doesn't want to be investigated:

Right. Tracking me is pointless, since I AM going to go after someone, someone that you all have agreed upon must die.

Investigate drabod, though. At least that will prove his innocence and we can move on.

Why are we leaving him alive?

[VioIet]

Drabod has not yet confirmed what Nark said, we need his confirmation on that. If we don't get it soon, I think the target is pretty obvious.

Not the target you are thinking however. Leave the whole nark and drab thing to me and Vic. I just pray that the docs prevent us from getting killed.

As for balance, we were told there was a SK in the flavor so we know she is there. There should be 3 scum with the kind of power the town supposedly is carrying. I have never seen a 2 man scum team in a game with more then 8 players

There was in San Francisco. But perhaps that wasn't the best example.

It is very hard for me to believe we have 3 mafia and a SK in an 11 player game. That means only 6 townies, one survivor or unsurvivor- since the world is ending. Three kills each night (remember AD plans to kill). If this setup is correct, and we don't lynch a scum on Day 1, then we are already at Lylo once day 2 begins.

Actually there can be up to 4 kills, if Drabod uses his kill as well.

I am more torn over whether to vote /. I actually believe AD's claim, however I want to lynch him because he wants to use his vigs powers. Lynching him would be a good way to prevent him from senseless killing.

However, weighing up all the odds, I would prefer to lynch /.

If we have a strange night, then we can return to AD or even commander tomorrow.

Vote /

[Commander9]

Got to agree with Vio and others who have said this - there's no way there are 3 mafia, a SK, a vig and a JOAT that can kill - something here horribly doesn't add up. Although, it's probably to leave this speculation until tomorrow, as this is just baseless specualtion, while tomorrow we should have some ideas about validity of it.

I don't really trust the way / played this (definitely not very town like), but same can be said about AD. I'd slightly prefer to pressure AD (just because I don't think his claim is worth 5 cents), but as I've stated before, I don't mind pressuring / either.

[Anarkistsdream]

Got to agree with Vio and others who have said this - there's no way there are 3 mafia, a SK, a vig and a JOAT that can kill - something here horribly doesn't add up. Although, it's probably to leave this speculation until tomorrow, as this is just baseless specualtion, while tomorrow we should have some ideas about validity of it.

I don't really trust the way / played this (definitely not very town like), but same can be said about AD. I'd slightly prefer to pressure AD (just because I don't think his claim is worth 5 cents), but as I've stated before, I don't mind pressuring / either.

What the hell are you gonna do to pressure me?

hahahahaha

[Commander9]

What the hell are you gonna do to pressure me?

hahahahaha

Not pressure - lynch you.

I basically see 2 main choices - pressure / or settle with lynching you. I'm sorry to say, but I'm just not buying your claim. If I'm wrong and you're indeed a townie, feel free to lynch me the next day.

[Anarkistsdream]

What the hell are you gonna do to pressure me?

hahahahaha

Not pressure - lynch you.

I basically see 2 main choices - pressure / or settle with lynching you. I'm sorry to say, but I'm just not buying your claim. If I'm wrong and you're indeed a townie, feel free to lynch me the next day.

Vio still thinks that you and / are the mob...

I tend to think she has some valid reasons... You two have pushed the hardest for the lynching of the towns most powerful couple.

We are both town. Killing me is not one scum for one town... It's two town... Two POWERFUL town.

[Commander9]

Vio still thinks that you and / are the mob...

I tend to think she has some valid reasons... You two have pushed the hardest for the lynching of the towns most powerful couple.

We are both town. Killing me is not one scum for one town... It's two town... Two POWERFUL town.

My problem with this is that it seems like too powerful along with what everything else we've found - I think you're lying. Okay, I've got a suggestion to make - you guys lynch me and if I turn out to be, you lynch AD.

For the record, I still think that / is likely mafia and we can go there, but I've presented an alternate suggestion if you guys are too afraid to lynch AD now.

[Anarkistsdream]

Vio still thinks that you and / are the mob...

I tend to think she has some valid reasons... You two have pushed the hardest for the lynching of the towns most powerful couple.

We are both town. Killing me is not one scum for one town... It's two town... Two POWERFUL town.

My problem with this is that it seems like too powerful along with what everything else we've found - I think you're lying. Okay, I've got a suggestion to make - you guys lynch me and if I turn out to be, you lynch AD.

For the record, I still think that / is likely mafia and we can go there, but I've presented an alternate suggestion if you guys are too afraid to lynch AD now.

I think most people are in agreement about /.

I still won't vote unless it is a hammer, though, because you guys all keep trying to act like I am shifting attention, so I will sit and wait until you guys come up with a conclusion.

By the way, we don't KNOW we have a three person mafia, we don't KNOW there is an SK.

Making these assumptions on Day 1 is dumb...

Also, after I come up town, I don't want anyone saying "Well, with the way Nark played, it sure SEEMED like he was scum..." To me, I am playing the way I always do, and people ALWAYS think I'm scum. I vote hop, I make unbased accusations, and I throw hissy fits for inactivity.

That is what I do. And I don't mind at all.

[safariguy5]

Vio still thinks that you and / are the mob...

I tend to think she has some valid reasons... You two have pushed the hardest for the lynching of the towns most powerful couple.

We are both town. Killing me is not one scum for one town... It's two town... Two POWERFUL town.

My problem with this is that it seems like too powerful along with what everything else we've found - I think you're lying. Okay, I've got a suggestion to make - you guys lynch me and if I turn out to be, you lynch AD.

For the record, I still think that / is likely mafia and we can go there, but I've presented an alternate suggestion if you guys are too afraid to lynch AD now.

Shoot, if we feel so strongly about / being mafia, why are we wasting time with nark? A town vig isn't dangerous if he's playing smart about who he kills. In my mind, a kill on anyone unclaimed as of right now isn't the worst idea. That said, / hasn't provided a defense that would dissuade me from believing he's probably scum. If we lynch a scum, I can think of no better end to this day 1. Like I said, if Nark is lying, it should be pretty obvious pretty soon. Let's look at his options if he is mafia.

1. Kill who we suggest: Thus leaving both a tracker and a cop to root out his buddies and eventually him.

2. Kill someone important: If we find out that our cop or doc or tracker died last night, then Nark is probably responsible. Then we lynch him and drabod as he's basically implicated both of them.

Now, this is operating under the assumption that it's simply 1 mafia faction with no SKer or other faction. Seriously guys, look at what happened in Matrix Mafia. We spent like 3 days worrying about Agent Smith recruiting power roles and we end up with him just being the mafia GF. As aage put it, "how the hell was I going to balance Agent Smith as cult recruiter". Do the math, 11 players with more than 1 anti-town factions is going to lead to a lot of deaths in very few days. How is that even balanced?

[DoomYoshi]

unvote vote /. Assuming all claims are at least partially true, this is our best bet right now. I am glad you have provided an alternative right now, commander, although I don't like it.

As I have said before, so much depends on drabod. At the current rate, I am starting to lean heavily towards the lynch of Nark, regardless of what Drabod says though. #1 if there is a town/mafia split (fairly likely considering the claims so far) it IS a good trade of a town for a mafia. #2 I am not sure I trust Nark and his ability roaming free through the streets (for the record, my door is now locked). Nark has lied in the past, so it is impossible to know, even if him and drab have their stories straight (which may be the reason his catching up is taking so long), whether or not they are true.

[Commander9]

May we get a vote count? Also, /, I think you may want to claim, as I think you are L-2 now.

[/]

Very well, I will state my claim, I am Matteo Biagio, Town Hider, If you want to test it am willing to let AD try to NK me tonight, at least then he won't have a chance to off a townie.

[pancakemix]

Regardless of whether or not you believe that claim:

1. We still need to hear from Drabod
2. We need to decide who Nark should kill if we're going to go that route.

So hold off for now. As far as the claim itself goes, I'm uncertain; that's an easy GF claim. That said, it's more believable than Nark's IMO.

[Commander9]

Regardless of whether or not you believe that claim:

1. We still need to hear from Drabod
2. We need to decide who Nark should kill if we're going to go that route.

So hold off for now. As far as the claim itself goes, I'm uncertain; that's an easy GF claim. That said, it's more believable than Nark's IMO.

Personally, I'm not buying either, but that's me.

[edocsil]

Very well, I will state my claim, I am Matteo Biagio, Town Hider, If you want to test it am willing to let AD try to NK me tonight, at least then he won't have a chance to off a townie.

Every time I have been a hider I have been scum. I would hang him.

[VioIet]

Something is not adding up. See below:

Town
Nark - town vig; drabod's lover
Sully - town deputy
Yoshi - town doctor
Edoc - town deputy's son
Vi - town
pancake- town governor
Drabod- Town JOAT, anark's lover
safari- town busdriver
/ - town hider

Survivor
spiesr - end of the world

Unkown
Commander

Like I said, something is not adding up. I'm not really sure what a town hider is anyway. Will keep my vote the same for now.

[Commander9]

Like I said, something is not adding up. I'm not really sure what a town hider is anyway. Will keep my vote the same for now.

http://mafiascum.net/wiki/index.php?title=Hider