Wait, What? Mafia (9/9) D2: Wait, What?

[jonty125]

Town. vote Nark for been unwilling to provide a defense I reckon he gave me this PR (tongue in cheek)

Oh my God... I told you what I did so you would know why you could trust me, and instead you vote me??? You also outed my role, when no one else may have figured it out...

You know what, this is ridiculous...

Vote: Anarkistsdream

unvote Nark I had no idea about your role.

[spiesr]

Okay, let's try to clarify what is going on here. Anarkistsdream is claiming to have the ability to give people Post Restrictions and that he used this to make Jonty say "Town" in his posts. Is this correct?
Anarkistsdream, would you please make a full claim since as far as I can tell there would be nothing for you to lose by doing so at this point?

[Anarkistsdream]

Okay, let's try to clarify what is going on here. Anarkistsdream is claiming to have the ability to give people Post Restrictions and that he used this to make Jonty say "Town" in his posts. Is this correct?
Anarkistsdream, would you please make a full claim since as far as I can tell there would be nothing for you to lose by doing so at this point?

Townie woth the ability to give two post restrictions a night... I have really great ideas, but I am pissed that they can be vetoed by both the mod and the player affected. I told Jonty that he must begin each post with his alignment... This was allowed since he was town.... I guess I can't do it to scum, which defeats the point. The other restriction was rejected by the player. So I can't make people be demeaning or poke fun at themselves... it is been a bit irritating to work with this. This could be an extremely fun and powerful role, but I feel that I am being a bit constrained. Which I understand, I suppose. Eh... Anyway, I was hinting to jonty that I was trustworthy, but apparently he found that aggressive? I don't know... I thought it was obvious, but... I guess you have to be totally blatant about everything these daya.

[HotShot53]

I now have my role PM and am ready to jump in

After re-reading this thread, the following is what I’ve gathered about each player:

1. Anarkistsdrean – Looks like town, since he seems to have a role to give post restrictions.
2. Lootifer – Am guessing town, because of x of mafia on day y. Also, Spiesr’s night search found him as vanilla towny
3. Gregwolf121 – no read really, makes pretty generic posts – scum?
4. Virus90 – linked to a cult description on first day, indicating he probably has the info about x mafia on y day, so I’m guessing town.
5. colton24/Metsfanmax – colton almost never posted, and metsfanmax just joined, so hasn’t had a chance to post much yet… will give him the benefit of the doubt for now even though he likes the Mets (Go Phillies!)
6. kratos644 – Am guessing town, because of x of mafia on day y
7. Spiesr – Night cop, town.
8. jonty125 – Looks like town, since Nark apparently gave him a post restriction that only applies to town members.
9. epic pie/HotShot53 – Well, I know I’m town lol.

So… for right now, my main suspicion is raised by Gregwolf121 for his extremely generic posts and just going with the flow. I’d suggest that he be researched by the daycop or nightcop or anyone else who can find out info on him. I have no clue who might have been recruited though.

Any disagreements about my thoughts or conclusions?

[Lootifer]

So you have replaced Epic?

[Lootifer]

er herp derp, caught skimming again... (I was caught skimming in the Valk thread too...)

[Lootifer]

EBWOP

@ Virus: What makes you think the original scum recruiter has the ability to kill?

I dont know, just assumed. might be wrong, but seemed logical.

Besides some of the arguments made by lootifier contradict knowledge I think I have.

That is exactly why I asked the question I did.

Next question: If you have information on the game why have you not come forward with it?

Virus you never answered this question.

[Lootifer]

Some further thoughts...

Scum: The is a note for everyone; remember that no one can be cleared in this game, except by our daycop, or by some other mechanic we dont as yet know about. There is a recruiter at play so your town reads based on D1 play may not be valid any longer. E.g. We know Spiesr started the game as town, but that does not mean he is right now. This applies to everyone, so be very careful when you state things like "Oh yeah so and so is town".

Anarkist: I am starting to think that most of my scum reads on him are simply because of his playstyle; however I have not seen anything that shows he isn't scum. He hasnt really provided a solid defense and his only offense has been aggressively in my direction - since I have been confirmed by two different people who started out as town I presume that Anarks vote will come off me? Also can you answer my earlier question about why you didnt use that PR you used on Jonty on me instead?

Gregwolf: Joined Anarks wagon on me pretty happily; and other than that hasnt generated a lot of content. I too smelling some scummyness when gregwolf walks in...

[virus90]

EBWOP

@ Virus: What makes you think the original scum recruiter has the ability to kill?

I dont know, just assumed. might be wrong, but seemed logical.

Besides some of the arguments made by lootifier contradict knowledge I think I have.

That is exactly why I asked the question I did.

Next question: If you have information on the game why have you not come forward with it?

Virus you never answered this question.

i came forward with it, not by saying the words "I KNOW ....." but from the beginning i have been hinting mafia recruiter, and just after the first night i confirmed this and underlined 2 mafia.

There is a mafia recruiter. Like i hinted many times before. We dont have a dead guy, that means either the doc saved spiesr, (if we have doc, and if we think the mafia would have killed spiesr) or more likely to my opinion, the recruiter chose to recruit someone instead of killing someone. if he recruited there are now 2 mafia

so i came forward with it, why not in straight answers, well i prefer to plant the seed for an idea and have you come up with it yourself, not looking forward to arguments about things i know that are true and having to convince people who think differently. why not let them convince themselves, saves me the argument. besides like you said yourself. if you have knowledge others might not have you can test if they are right. so another reason for not saying it to explicit.

and well there is no way to know for sure there are now 2 mafia, i am 99% sure, since i cant imagine that the recruiter would choose not to recruit.

[virus90]

also i posted the 2 mafia comment. before you said you knew there was 1 mafia to begin with, i knew that too,and posted it before you, only i did it in a more cryptic way since i was not being attacked by anyone so no need to spill the credits i could use later.
enough of an answer?

[Lootifer]

I think so. Cheers.

[Metsfanmax]

Also can you answer my earlier question about why you didnt use that PR you used on Jonty on me instead?

Perhaps he and jonty are both scum and he did it to clear them both.

[Metsfanmax]

Also, I just realized something obvious related to Loot's claim (forgive me if someone already pointed this out): suppose there are more than one Vanilla Townie #X (this seems logical, given that Loot was not #1, so there probably is a #1). Then, that logically means there's some sort of mechanism that automatically recruits people to the mafia.

[HotShot53]

Also can you answer my earlier question about why you didnt use that PR you used on Jonty on me instead?

Perhaps he and jonty are both scum and he did it to clear them both.

Apparently the second scum didn't get created until the end of the night phase... so would have been impossible to use it on a fellow scum before he knew the other guy made him a scum.

[Metsfanmax]

Also can you answer my earlier question about why you didnt use that PR you used on Jonty on me instead?

Perhaps he and jonty are both scum and he did it to clear them both.

Apparently the second scum didn't get created until the end of the night phase... so would have been impossible to use it on a fellow scum before he knew the other guy made him a scum.

Well, I'm reaching here -- but what if nark was the original scum, and knew that jonty would be the next recruit (or guided this) and used the PR on him to pre-clear him as he switched?

[HotShot53]

Also, I just realized something obvious related to Loot's claim (forgive me if someone already pointed this out): suppose there are more than one Vanilla Townie #X (this seems logical, given that Loot was not #1, so there probably is a #1). Then, that logically means there's some sort of mechanism that automatically recruits people to the mafia.

Most people say that the scum is a recruiting mafia of some sort, so he'd pick a new person to his team each night presumably. Hopefully after we find and lynch him the recruiting stops... not sure what the remaining mafia members would do at that point.

[HotShot53]

Also can you answer my earlier question about why you didnt use that PR you used on Jonty on me instead?

Perhaps he and jonty are both scum and he did it to clear them both.

Apparently the second scum didn't get created until the end of the night phase... so would have been impossible to use it on a fellow scum before he knew the other guy made him a scum.

Well, I'm reaching here -- but what if nark was the original scum, and knew that jonty would be the next recruit (or guided this) and used the PR on him to pre-clear him as he switched?

I kind of really doubt he'd get the PR giving ability on top of being the mafia recruiter... a bit far of a stretch for me

[Metsfanmax]

Also, I just realized something obvious related to Loot's claim (forgive me if someone already pointed this out): suppose there are more than one Vanilla Townie #X (this seems logical, given that Loot was not #1, so there probably is a #1). Then, that logically means there's some sort of mechanism that automatically recruits people to the mafia.

Most people say that the scum is a recruiting mafia of some sort, so he'd pick a new person to his team each night presumably. Hopefully after we find and lynch him the recruiting stops... not sure what the remaining mafia members would do at that point.

Yeah but there's something unequivocal about how Loot described the role. He said that there will be X mafia on Day X. What if the mafia recruiter misses his night action? Then the role PM would be incorrect. So my guess is that there's some other mechanism in play.

[kratos644]

Quick question for Loot. In your role pm did it tell you the number that would be in the mafia on day x already or was it a thing where the mod would let you know on day x how many mafia there would be

[Metsfanmax]

Also, my hypothesis is backed up by James saying this:

To kratos- Communication is open between all anti-town factions (if they exist), assuming each one has more than one member, which they may or May not.. Since I have no way to facilitate communication, if any is going on since some anti-town factions, assuming they exist and have more than one member to communicate with (that'd be kinda sad to send yourself night PM's..), they might have spoken but I wouldn't know or be able to do anything. If they exist, I would have instructed he/she/it/them to keep chatter to night, but they would have been informed if any changes were made to the participants of their faction.

Why would he need to say that if mafia are working together to choose a recruitment target? Sounds like they're being automatically handed recruits.

Also, it's about time to get things going. I just paid closer attention to what happened before I joined, so it's time for me to claim: I'm Vanilla Townie #2. This means I know that on D2 (i.e. today) there are two mafia alive, just as Lootifer's role. This basically contradicts virus90. He has been hinting that he is VT #2 as well:

i came forward with it, not by saying the words "I KNOW ....." but from the beginning i have been hinting mafia recruiter, and just after the first night i confirmed this and underlined 2 mafia.

so i came forward with it, why not in straight answers, well i prefer to plant the seed for an idea and have you come up with it yourself, not looking forward to arguments about things i know that are true and having to convince people who think differently. why not let them convince themselves, saves me the argument. besides like you said yourself. if you have knowledge others might not have you can test if they are right. so another reason for not saying it to explicit.

and well there is no way to know for sure there are now 2 mafia, i am 99% sure, since i cant imagine that the recruiter would choose not to recruit.

I was originally suspicious of him because he jumped on the roleclaim bandwagon after the D2 scene, after kratos and Loot had already claimed. This is too convenient.

So, if you believe me, then we should lynch virus90 unless he comes up with a really good defense.

Unvote
Vote virus90

[Anarkistsdream]

Also can you answer my earlier question about why you didnt use that PR you used on Jonty on me instead?

Perhaps he and jonty are both scum and he did it to clear them both.

Apparently the second scum didn't get created until the end of the night phase... so would have been impossible to use it on a fellow scum before he knew the other guy made him a scum.

Well, I'm reaching here -- but what if nark was the original scum, and knew that jonty would be the next recruit (or guided this) and used the PR on him to pre-clear him as he switched?

I kind of really doubt he'd get the PR giving ability on top of being the mafia recruiter... a bit far of a stretch for me

Thank you... That would be ridiculous... And I certainly wouldn't have tried to get Jonty to see my tricky post if I was scum... I wouldn't want anybody to know my skill... Also, why would I want to make him tell everyone else that he is town? By outing townies, I would make the game harder on myself...

[Metsfanmax]

Thank you... That would be ridiculous... And I certainly wouldn't have tried to get Jonty to see my tricky post if I was scum... I wouldn't want anybody to know my skill... Also, why would I want to make him tell everyone else that he is town? By outing townies, I would make the game harder on myself...

I didn't suggest that he's town. In this scenario, you two are both the only mafia (as of D2) and you gave him this post restriction to clear him, and yourself. However, I confess that it depends on you knowing before the night ends that he would be the next recruit. But perhaps you did, if you're scum. Anyway, I'm leaning more towards virus now.

[spiesr]

Thank you... That would be ridiculous... And I certainly wouldn't have tried to get Jonty to see my tricky post if I was scum... I wouldn't want anybody to know my skill... Also, why would I want to make him tell everyone else that he is town? By outing townies, I would make the game harder on myself...

Although at this point we can't rule out that you & Jonty are scum mates and are faking your post restriction granting power. (Since the mod confirmed that scum could talk during the Day this could have been coordinated.)

[kratos644]

Thank you... That would be ridiculous... And I certainly wouldn't have tried to get Jonty to see my tricky post if I was scum... I wouldn't want anybody to know my skill... Also, why would I want to make him tell everyone else that he is town? By outing townies, I would make the game harder on myself...

Although at this point we can't rule out that you & Jonty are scum mates and are faking your post restriction granting power. (Since the mod confirmed that scum could talk during the Day this could have been coordinated.)

That's what I thought, too but the. A second person got post restrictions no?

[Anarkistsdream]

Thank you... That would be ridiculous... And I certainly wouldn't have tried to get Jonty to see my tricky post if I was scum... I wouldn't want anybody to know my skill... Also, why would I want to make him tell everyone else that he is town? By outing townies, I would make the game harder on myself...

Although at this point we can't rule out that you & Jonty are scum mates and are faking your post restriction granting power. (Since the mod confirmed that scum could talk during the Day this could have been coordinated.)

That's what I thought, too but the. A second person got post restrictions no?

As I posted... Skimmer.... He told the mod no, so the mod told me no, and I just got screwed out of one, with the promise that I will have three the next night. However, the post restrictions are very weak powered and, while they may force people to do silly things, they won't aid in town defeating scum as I had hoped... The only reason Jonty is forced into his is because he is in fact town... That leads me to believe that, if I were to give that to scum, I would be told I am not able to force that on a player. *shrug* However, if this changing mafia idea is true, than at any dawn he could have an alignment change... Hell, we all could. Which makes for a very profound and awesome idea from James.