too many team games

[DiM]

i was just browsing the public games list looking for a nice game to join.

to my surprise in the first 200 games i found only 5 singles games.

why? that's 2.5% of the games i looked.

i usually use game finder and select my settings to find my games. this is probably the first time in a long time when i've browsed the public games and i'm really surprised to see this.

not to mention the singles games i found where full of cooks or cadets

don't higher ranked players play public singles games anymore?


PS: i repeat PUBLIC games. i know there are plenty of private ones.

i guess i'm just a bit upset to see this because i consider risk a game where you must win on your own not as a part of a team. but that's just me.

[dominationnation]

I think that its not so much that there arnt as many as that they get filled quicker. If you look on page 6 or 7 you will find al most all singles. Many with some semi high ranked players. Personally I rarely join games and start most of the games I play.

[hulmey]

I think this ALL boils down to the points system....Mosat of the higher ranked players only play triples adn doubles and they do this to sustain their ranking in the top flight...

I think Lack should take a good look at the scoring system and maybe make seperate scoreboards Singles and Doubles!!!

It is getting beyond a joke.............

[Genghis Khan CA]

Your results are distorted as public singles games fill a lot quicker than team games. I know if I set up a public team game, particularly a triples game it can take up to a week for it to fill. Most singles games fill within the day.

I did a quick search of active public games and there are 92 pages of active public singles games (standard, terminator, assassin, excluding 1v1) and 25 pages of active public team games (doubles and triples).

Admittedly I tend to only play against other high ranks in my singles games, but I enjoy the challenge of playing against the best players. There are still a number of high ranked players who play public games though.

[wacicha]

usually I staret 50 games and most are gone in 4 hours and all within the day

[Point Guard]

If you do a game search, you will see that there has been more non team games than team games.

[misterman10]

I hate team games

[rsuttles58]

I hate team games

Likewise. I hate team games.

I like the idea that hulmey said about having singles and team rankings. That would be pretty cool IMO.

[DiM]

i usually start my games or get invited to private games or set up private games with friends so i don't lack the action but the main problem is that because of the scoring system it has come to this.

what i don't understand is the fun part of playing team games on the same map with the same settings and the same partners. especially since most of the time the opponents are low ranks that never played as a team before.

don't people get bored with this?

this is the equivalent of grinding in RPG games. i remember in morrowind at one point i needed strength a lot. so i put my character to swim straight into a wall and put a paper weight on the up arrow. left it for a few hours and i had max strength. a boring task but indeed my purpose was fulfilled.

this is what's going on in CC at the top. of course not all the players at the top do it but there are plenty of them to consider this a spread phenomenon.

i always thought games are supposed to be fun above everything. i've never played an online game to become #1 or to hold a record or something. i've played it to have fun. sometimes from this fun also came performance. i've been to #1 spots in other online games but i never aimed for that place i simply got there and never sacrificed fun to do it.

it's 4:30 am and perhaps i'm not very coherent but please keep reading.

so why are people sacrificing fun to obtain performance? will they get any recognition? no. i'll probably never meet any of the players in the top 10 so i won't be able to show my respect face to face. i frankly don't really care who they are and what they do in real life. does holding a #1 spot really grant you any real advantage? will your wife and kids love you more if they find out you are the top gun in CC?? again, no.

perhaps i am wrong when i say they don't have fun maybe they really do.

let's analyze he situation a bit.

same partners same map same settings poor opponents.
let's say the partners are very close friends and you enjoy the chat but to play the same map on the same settings over and over again until you reach perfection, until you start dreaming it in your sleep seems very boring to me. but there are people that prefer to perfection in a single area than near perfection in many more areas. but what about the opponents. this is what i don't understand. where's the fun in beating 2 cooks and 1 deadbeat in a triples game? those poor guys are losers even before the game starts. they have no idea on how to coordinate against a perfected machine. so where's the fun in taking candy from a baby? if they want high scores why don't the high ranks play against other high ranks? much more strategy involved and hence much more fun. not to mention more points.

never in my life have i chosen to compare myself with weaker persons. i've always confronted better ones, always tried to find ways to improve myself and jump to the next level. yes sometimes you lose but you learn from your mistakes and maybe the next time you will prevail. that is the only way to advance. measure your strength against the best not against the worst.

now i's 4:45. i'm lighting up a marlboro and i'm looking at the scoreboard. i'm curious how many of the 198 people with a better score than me would accept a challenge to play in some standard games. i'm sure not to many. i'm pissed. and tired and bored. i can't find a single speed game with players over 2000 points

[Point Guard]

You can find high ranked standard speed games if you look hard enough.

http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=837989

[Cronus]

the vast majority of games are singles, not team games. Team games just take a lot longer to fill up so there are more of them waiting for players. Just look at the active games. There are far more singles.

[DiM]

Your results are distorted as public singles games fill a lot quicker than team games. I know if I set up a public team game, particularly a triples game it can take up to a week for it to fill. Most singles games fill within the day.

I did a quick search of active public games and there are 92 pages of active public singles games (standard, terminator, assassin, excluding 1v1) and 25 pages of active public team games (doubles and triples).

Admittedly I tend to only play against other high ranks in my singles games, but I enjoy the challenge of playing against the best players. There are still a number of high ranked players who play public games though.

of course my results are distorted. i analyzed a really small sample (200 games) i'm not saying my numbers are accurate. but the fact is that there are so many team games.

search doubs and trips public waiting for players. 4 pages
search standard terminator and assassin 3-6 players. 2 pages.

yes i know there are still high ranked players that play public singles. but they seem to be fewer and fewer

[Cronus]

You can find high ranked standard speed games if you look hard enough.

http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=837989

that game is a PRIVATE SPEED GAME (plug the number in game finder), which he explicitly said he doesn't care about.

[DiM]

You can find high ranked standard speed games if you look hard enough.

http://www.conquerclub.com/game.php?game=837989

that was a private game. i'm talking about public ones

[Cronus]

Your results are distorted as public singles games fill a lot quicker than team games. I know if I set up a public team game, particularly a triples game it can take up to a week for it to fill. Most singles games fill within the day.

I did a quick search of active public games and there are 92 pages of active public singles games (standard, terminator, assassin, excluding 1v1) and 25 pages of active public team games (doubles and triples).

Admittedly I tend to only play against other high ranks in my singles games, but I enjoy the challenge of playing against the best players. There are still a number of high ranked players who play public games though.

of course my results are distorted. i analyzed a really small sample (200 games) i'm not saying my numbers are accurate. but the fact is that there are so many team games.

search doubs and trips public waiting for players. 4 pages
search standard terminator and assassin 3-6 players. 2 pages.

yes i know there are still high ranked players that play public singles. but they seem to be fewer and fewer

There's actually like a ratio of 5 singles games for every team game created at least under public games. Just look them up. Singles games take hours to fill and sometimes less than an hour, team games can take days.

[DiM]

the vast majority of games are singles, not team games. Team games just take a lot longer to fill up so there are more of them waiting for players. Just look at the active games. There are far more singles.

yes of course there are more singles games than team games. it's normal. but what i'm talking about is high ranked singles games. those are really hard to find because more and more people start abandoning the singles and switching to team games as their rank increases. that's the phenomenon that's bugging me. why abandon the fun of singles? just for rank? it has been proved that you can be on top by playing just singles. of course team games are easier but why chose the easy path?

[Point Guard]

lol...I thought all speed games were public.

speed game set if anyone wants in
usual password
classic, escalating
5 player
adjacent ( I think)

found in the callouts forum heres the link
posted in the CC 2000 thread, but its a doubles game and yes it is private

http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewto ... 248#676248

[Cronus]

the vast majority of games are singles, not team games. Team games just take a lot longer to fill up so there are more of them waiting for players. Just look at the active games. There are far more singles.

yes of course there are more singles games than team games. it's normal. but what i'm talking about is high ranked singles games. those are really hard to find because more and more people start abandoning the singles and switching to team games as their rank increases. that's the phenomenon that's bugging me. why abandon the fun of singles? just for rank? it has been proved that you can be on top by playing just singles. of course team games are easier but why chose the easy path?

well if by high rank, you mean captain and up, only 1 in 72 active players on CC are that high so naturally there would be very few high rank singles games. Also, when a high rank person creates one, low ranks swoop to the challenge in order for a chance of high points without risking that many...so it is rare to have a public singles game that is all high rank

[DiM]

the vast majority of games are singles, not team games. Team games just take a lot longer to fill up so there are more of them waiting for players. Just look at the active games. There are far more singles.

yes of course there are more singles games than team games. it's normal. but what i'm talking about is high ranked singles games. those are really hard to find because more and more people start abandoning the singles and switching to team games as their rank increases. that's the phenomenon that's bugging me. why abandon the fun of singles? just for rank? it has been proved that you can be on top by playing just singles. of course team games are easier but why chose the easy path?

well if by high rank, you mean captain and up, only 1 in 72 active players on CC are that high so naturally there would be very few high rank singles games. Also, when a high rank person creates one, low ranks swoop to the challenge in order for a chance of high points without risking that many...so it is rare to have a public singles game that is all high rank

i guess you are right. as i said i'm tired and sleepy it's now 05.07 am.
if a captain or higher starts a public game it fills up quickly.

but then i come with the question, why play team games and not singles games? are points really that important? is it worth it?

[Cronus]

the vast majority of games are singles, not team games. Team games just take a lot longer to fill up so there are more of them waiting for players. Just look at the active games. There are far more singles.

yes of course there are more singles games than team games. it's normal. but what i'm talking about is high ranked singles games. those are really hard to find because more and more people start abandoning the singles and switching to team games as their rank increases. that's the phenomenon that's bugging me. why abandon the fun of singles? just for rank? it has been proved that you can be on top by playing just singles. of course team games are easier but why chose the easy path?

well if by high rank, you mean captain and up, only 1 in 72 active players on CC are that high so naturally there would be very few high rank singles games. Also, when a high rank person creates one, low ranks swoop to the challenge in order for a chance of high points without risking that many...so it is rare to have a public singles game that is all high rank

i guess you are right. as i said i'm tired and sleepy it's now 05.07 am.
if a captain or higher starts a public game it fills up quickly.

but then i come with the question, why play team games and not singles games? are points really that important? is it worth it?

2 weeks ago I would have said no when I had reached 2250+ points, but then I got knocked down to private in a series of 30+ straight losses on standard escalating maps that makes me sad because I can no longer join the private 2000+ singles games

[DiM]

i just searched the waiting for players games with the following settings:

standard terminator or assassin and public.

i looked at the people that started the games.

in 2 pages (that's all i found just 2 pages) i saw 1 major 1 lieutenant and the rest were sergeant or lower. so just 2 players over 1800 points from 600 existing. whare are the rest of 598?

[Genghis Khan CA]

yes of course there are more singles games than team games. it's normal. but what i'm talking about is high ranked singles games. those are really hard to find because more and more people start abandoning the singles and switching to team games as their rank increases. that's the phenomenon that's bugging me. why abandon the fun of singles? just for rank? it has been proved that you can be on top by playing just singles. of course team games are easier but why chose the easy path?

No offence but weren't you trying to imply the exact opposite in your first post?

Did it ever occur to you that some people might enjoy playing team games more than singles in the same way that you enjoy singles more than team games? I know of quite a few high ranked players who are very accomplished in the singles game type who choose not to play many because they enjoy playing with a team more, and the friendship and working together that comes with it.

I agree that, for me, I would not choose to only play team games, because I enjoy singles a lot too. But I really enjoy team games as well, playing with my friends against strong opposition.

And I agree with you that I would find playing the same maps against newbies all the time boring, so I choose not to do this. But if others derive pleasure from it, what is the harm in that?

Your rank suggests you are a good player DiM, you have earned your diamond, so if you want to play the top players in singles why don't you join some of the 2000+ games? I'm sure you'll have a lot of fun in them and maybe learn something too... I know I did when I started playing them. There are plenty who play in them and on a variety of settings too.

The number of singles games I play against good ranks (captains and majors+) would suggest that there are plenty who have not abandonded singles. We just choose to play our games privately, in part for the challenge of beating good players, in part because some of the lower ranks who don't understand the game as well can ruin a good game, and in part because of the point benefits.

If you think of it in sporting terms - the top teams in football play in the Premier League, or equivalent in their own country... you don't get Chelsea or Manchester United playing against fourth division teams like Grimsby or Peterborough - there just isn't the same level of competition and enjoyment that you get in an evenly balanced game.

This is just my opinion anyway, and I accept that some enjoy playing against lower ranks too, and I respect that and think it is good that we all play the types of games we enjoy playing and don't worry about the types of games other players are playing.

[Genghis Khan CA]

i just searched the waiting for players games with the following settings:

standard terminator or assassin and public.

i looked at the people that started the games.

in 2 pages (that's all i found just 2 pages) i saw 1 major 1 lieutenant and the rest were sergeant or lower. so just 2 players over 1800 points from 600 existing. whare are the rest of 598?

As has been pointed out to you many times in this thread, checking the waiting for players has a ridiculously high level of selection bias, given that singles games started by high ranked payers fill so quickly, so you would expect there not to be too many... you should do your analysis on active games and share your results.

[DiM]

yes of course there are more singles games than team games. it's normal. but what i'm talking about is high ranked singles games. those are really hard to find because more and more people start abandoning the singles and switching to team games as their rank increases. that's the phenomenon that's bugging me. why abandon the fun of singles? just for rank? it has been proved that you can be on top by playing just singles. of course team games are easier but why chose the easy path?

No offence but weren't you trying to imply the exact opposite in your first post?

hey it's 5.30 am as i said i might be incoherent at this hour

Did it ever occur to you that some people might enjoy playing team games more than singles in the same way that you enjoy singles more than team games? I know of quite a few high ranked players who are very accomplished in the singles game type who choose not to play many because they enjoy playing with a team more, and the friendship and working together that comes with it.

i already said team games have a certain degree of fun especially against friends but some players at the top chose to become super specialized in 1 map and same settings with same partners just to maximize their chances of getting points. that doesn't seem fun

I agree that, for me, I would not choose to only play team games, because I enjoy singles a lot too. But I really enjoy team games as well, playing with my friends against strong opposition.

exactly, why abandon singles like so many have?
out of curiosity i searched JR24's last 6 player standard game. it was a loooong time ago.

And I agree with you that I would find playing the same maps against newbies all the time boring, so I choose not to do this. But if others derive pleasure from it, what is the harm in that?

absolutely no harm on my behalf but i'm really curious where's the fun in beating a team of noobs and getting 5 points from them? you earn few points and there's absolutely nothing to learn.

Your rank suggests you are a good player DiM, you have earned your diamond, so if you want to play the top players in singles why don't you join some of the 2000+ games? I'm sure you'll have a lot of fun in them and maybe learn something too... I know I did when I started playing them. There are plenty who play in them and on a variety of settings too.

i have recently discovered the 2000+ thread but haven't joined anything yet. i don't have the time to join any more games at this point. i play my current active ones and some speed games when i get a few free minutes.

The number of singles games I play against good ranks (captains and majors+) would suggest that there are plenty who have not abandonded singles. We just choose to play our games privately, in part for the challenge of beating good players, in part because some of the lower ranks who don't understand the game as well can ruin a good game, and in part because of the point benefits.

you are right here. nothing to argue

If you think of it in sporting terms - the top teams in football play in the Premier League, or equivalent in their own country... you don't get Chelsea or Manchester United playing against fourth division teams like Grimsby or Peterborough - there just isn't the same level of competition and enjoyment that you get in an evenly balanced game.

exactly. if man u would start playing only fourth division teams they would win most of the games but after a few hundred games versus those teams they'd probably lose a lot of their skill and chelsea would trash them

This is just my opinion anyway, and I accept that some enjoy playing against lower ranks too, and I respect that and think it is good that we all play the types of games we enjoy playing and don't worry about the types of games other players are playing.

[Genghis Khan CA]

Well, nothing I can disagree on there... always fun debating with you DiM, and I mean that Now probably time for you to get some sleep mate, and for me to get some lunch!