Conquer Club

Hi,
I'm a relative newbie to CC and BOB. (2 months experience but loving every minute)

Could someone give a details of the algorithm to show how the 'Strength' stat is calculated.

Many thanks for all the effort that all the programmers have put in to make this a super add-on to a super on-line game.

Cheers
MoreTeaVicar

I don't know exactually but it is a formula for amount of territorys and armies and continents held.

Disclaimer this is just how I look at the game, feel free to disagree


Stregth is a rather abstract concept and varies from game to game, generally speaking you should look at 4 things in this order with the first being the most important and the last being the least important.

For a 2 person game. - Two person games are special because it is a zero-sum game. If you gain they lose and visa versa, so thats why when your determining their strength you cannot consider other people, hence the separate list.

1) Do they have a continent?

2) How many territories do they have? (this is especially important in a 2 player game because CC gives 1 army for every 3 territories held above nine so if they hold 18 territories, 18-9 /3 = 3 so in effect they have a "continent" worth 3 if you let them get too many territories)

3) how likely is it that they can get a continent within 1-2 turns?

4) how many cards do they have?

For any other Game.

1) Do they have a continent?

2) Are they unchallenged? (someone just sitting and building up armies is a major red flag for concern whereas two people fighting will wear each other down)

3) Is their base close to where you are buliding up? (unlike a 2 person game, if they are far, chances are someone else will take them out)

4) How many cards do they have?



Generally speaking the more yes or high number answers you have to those questions, they more of a threat they are. Of course with a game like risk, everything is relative. If they have 1 continent and you have 3, this chart is completely invalid. This is more for the beginning of the game when everyone is just starting to build up. Once everyone is set into place, stregth becomes a matter of armies and income (how many armies they get a turn). Add the number of armies they have to three times their income and the higher number is generally the more powerful one at the moment, again variable depending on the situation and only applies to multi person game. For two player games there is never going to be a built up phase, as a zero sum game you should always take out their territories instead of neutrals in order to go for the invisible continent of having many territories, as well as decreasing their revenue.

Many thanks Soundout9 and RisingSun for your replies.

I appreciate that the strength value is a mathematical calculation based on various factors, I was enquiring if one of the programmers would share the actual algorithm that is used. Therefore I can determine what reliance if any can be placed on these numbers when playing a fogged game.

Over to a programmer for input please. Yeti_C ?

Cheers
MoreTeaVicar

MoreTeaVicar wrote:Many thanks Soundout9 and RisingSun for your replies.

I appreciate that the strength value is a mathematical calculation based on various factors, I was enquiring if one of the programmers would share the actual algorithm that is used. Therefore I can determine what reliance if any can be placed on these numbers when playing a fogged game.

Over to a programmer for input please. Yeti_C ?

Cheers
MoreTeaVicar

Your best bet is to ask in the AJAX BOB thread.

Strength is the current armies of the player plus the armies they are expected to get next turn minus 2/3 times the number of territories they control, rounded to the nearest hundredth. Don't ask me why they came up with this, I'm just reading it off the javascript.

Nobuo wrote:Strength is the current armies of the player plus the armies they are expected to get next turn minus 2/3 times the number of territories they control, rounded to the nearest hundredth. Don't ask me why they came up with this, I'm just reading it off the javascript.

Sounds about right - I did a search for this - but essentially it's a formula inherited from tr0y's script...

C.

MoreTeaVicar wrote:Therefore I can determine what reliance if any can be placed on these numbers when playing a fogged game.

Well in that instance - the data is only calculated depending upon what *you* know...

So unless you can see that they own a whole continent - then the strength will not be calculated on that...

i.e. if someone holds Oceania in classic - you will never know - because you won't be able to see it all... thus the Strength calculation will not know that either.

C.

Thanks for the info Nobuo and Yeti_C

That's just what I wanted. I knew it would only be calculated on known infomation but I thought if I knew how it was calculated I would be better advised when to rely on the raw numbers and when to take it with a larger pinch of salt.

As a result of the info I have a follow-up question.

The formula outlined by Nobuo makes no reference to continent bonus, yet Yeti_C refers to this (if it is know by map) Is this purely as a result of the increased number of armies awarded in the previous round.

A slight off-subject question, what is 'TB' - single territory bonus. I don't think I have seen a value under this heading. I mainly play Classic and World 2.1

Cheers
MTV

Extra to above post.........

I have just performed a few test additions using Nobuo, and the calculation works. However this uses the VISIBLE number of territories. Shouldn't the equation be adjusted to use the CALCULATED number of territories.

MTV

I have looked more closely at the calculation, and found that it uses visible armies and visible territories as it's basis.

BOB already calculates a reliable value of territories held and I believe this should be source of it's calculations.

I propose an adjusted to the algorithm using TOTAL estimated armies (armies currently held PLUS next armies due) as the basis of overall strength.

This raises two questions - 1 How to value armies held for fogged territoies and 2 How to value continent based reinforcements in a fogged game

My proposal below assumes unseen territories hold 1.5 armies (subject to review by others).

It also assumes that the continent bonus is equivalent to last reinforcements less predicted reinforcements and this value is added subject to an invisibility fraction of territories. ie If all territories are visible then predicted reinforcements is correct therefore no addition. If no territories are visible then 100% of the continent bonus is added.

the algorithm is therefore:

Visible Armies
PLUS
(calc territories - visible territories) * 1.5 armies
PLUS
Calculated Armies Due
PLUS
(Prev reinforcements - Calc Reinforcements) * (1 - (visible territories / calc territories))

Please advise if this has any merits etc

MTV

NB I am a qualified Accountant and former theoretical Systems Analyst although I have only a rudimentary programming experience obtained at school/college.

The territory bonus comes into play on maps like AOR Might and Magic. On these maps, there is an auto-deploy on certain territories (the castles). These show up in [brackets] instead of (parenthesis).