Conquer Club

Posted: **Sun Jul 17, 2011 4:49 pm**

Concise description:

Stop banning the use of certain offensive words in what is supposed to be an adult site, with people perfectly able of ignoring who they want, when they want.

Specifics/Details:

Quite simple really - just promote the FAMO philosophy.
The game chat guidelines speak of "crossing a specific line" but there is NO specific line anyway, just an ambiguous "well, I found that more offensive than that, therefore it's a warning."

How this will benefit the site and/or other comments:

Less work for the C&A mods
People will stop being warned for using a word they didn't even know was bad/banned
Some people will have to find something else to moan about; this will hopefully take a week or two and give the forum a break from their constant whining about not having a life

Posted: **Sun Jul 17, 2011 4:50 pm**

What's a "sepcific" word?

Also, I agree with this but there's no way they'll change the rules. Trust me.

Posted: **Sun Jul 17, 2011 4:55 pm**

Army of GOD wrote:What's a "sepcific" word?

Haha how embarrassing! Got it right in the post but not the title O:)

Corrected now, thankyou Sir :oops:

Posted: **Sun Jul 17, 2011 4:59 pm**

I live to serve.

Posted: **Sun Jul 17, 2011 10:08 pm**

Agreed.

While I do think people should watch there tongues at times. I also believe that the first amendment ought to be upheld. Though this is a privately owned site, and ultimately it is the owners decision.

Posted: **Sun Jul 17, 2011 10:17 pm**

Posted: **Mon Jul 18, 2011 12:05 am**

Dibbun will have to find something else to moan about; this will hopefully take a week or two and give the forum a break from his constant whining about not having a life

A suggestion and a bait. :roll:

So when people in game chat throw N***** and F****** and whatever bs in game chats and think its absolutely ok I bet some of them would start using it on walls and in the forums and the mods would be busy with those.

I'm thinking we don't need the obvious slurs slung all over the site.

Pass.

Posted: **Mon Jul 18, 2011 3:38 am**

jefjef wrote:So when people in game chat throw N***** and F****** and whatever bs in game chats and think its absolutely ok I bet some of them would start using it on walls and in the forums and the mods would be busy with those.

I'm thinking we don't need the obvious slurs slung all over the site.

Pass.

I can see your point jefjef, and yes that is an issue. But it's such an ambiguous rule, and many people don't know what is and isn't acceptable (yet are punished all the same). The words you mentioned have been clearly identified as unacceptable through C&A reports, yet there is nowhere listing them as such. New recruits have no clue they're not allowed to say them, yet other equally offensive words are fine to say.

EDIT: Also, removed anything that might be construed as a bait, as this IS a serious suggestion.

Posted: **Mon Jul 18, 2011 6:48 am**

Martin Ronne wrote:Agreed.

While I do think people should watch there tongues at times. I also believe that the first amendment ought to be upheld. Though this is a privately owned site, and ultimately it is the owners decision.

Why would an amendment to a singular constitution be appropriate on an international site :shock:

Posted: **Mon Jul 18, 2011 6:56 am**

comic boy wrote:
Martin Ronne wrote:Agreed.

While I do think people should watch there tongues at times. I also believe that the first amendment ought to be upheld. Though this is a privately owned site, and ultimately it is the owners decision.

Why would an amendment to a singular constitution be appropriate on an international site

And why should words offensive to an American be considered no-no's on an international site, whereas words offensive to other cultures are not?

Posted: **Mon Jul 18, 2011 9:30 am**

Pander88uk wrote:EDIT: Also, removed anything that might be construed as a bait, as this IS a serious suggestion.

Already reported you before you edited it. Enjoy your forum vacation since I know you've already been warned about harassing me.

Posted: **Mon Jul 18, 2011 10:25 am**

Dibbun wrote:
Pander88uk wrote:EDIT: Also, removed anything that might be construed as a bait, as this IS a serious suggestion.

Already reported you before you edited it. Enjoy your forum vacation since I know you've already been warned about harassing me.

Please keep on topic here. Post reported for trolling. I'd already removed any potential bait so there was no need for your troll.

Posted: **Mon Jul 18, 2011 12:41 pm**

sadly its not an adult site and there are many minors on here. The appeal being its free.

Posted: **Mon Jul 18, 2011 12:48 pm**

hmsps wrote:sadly its not an adult site and there are many minors on here. The appeal being its free.

The problem I have with this argument is that so many nasty words ARE allowed. There seem to be a few that CC take offence to, but words like "f**king", "c**t", "r****d" etc. are considered perfectly fine. If minors are on here, then shouldn't we ban these too?

Posted: **Mon Jul 18, 2011 1:02 pm**

Personally, I would appreciate it if the ambiguity regarding the banned words were removed. It would be fine to me if no specific words at all were banned. It would also be clear if all insulting and namecalling was forbidden. I would even be happy if there was a list of which words would get you in trouble.

The current situation, where a number of specific words are banned but the only way of discovering which words are and are not allowed is by looking at previous jurisprudence in the C&A forum, is unacceptable and needs changing, IMO. That leaves far to much unclarity to normal members.

Posted: **Mon Jul 18, 2011 3:20 pm**

Pander88uk wrote:I can see your point jefjef, and yes that is an issue. But it's such an ambiguous rule, and many people don't know what is and isn't acceptable (yet are punished all the same).

Many people don't know of the Multi/Secret Diplomacy rule, yet they still get busted/Warned for it. Should we change that rule too? (I'm being serious here)

Posted: **Mon Jul 18, 2011 4:02 pm**

TheForgivenOne wrote:
Pander88uk wrote:I can see your point jefjef, and yes that is an issue. But it's such an ambiguous rule, and many people don't know what is and isn't acceptable (yet are punished all the same).

Many people don't know of the Multi/Secret Diplomacy rule, yet they still get busted/Warned for it. Should we change that rule too? (I'm being serious here)

I have to disagree with that. When signing up for a new account there is a clear message:
"Warning: Having multiple accounts is considered cheating. We routinely scan for multiple accounts and offending members will be banned from Conquer Club."

The difference with SD as well is that once warned for that, or mentioned, then the person KNOWS not to do it again. It isn't ambiguous. Also, it's in the clear written rules, unlike what words are/are not allowed.

Posted: **Mon Jul 18, 2011 4:30 pm**

It's pretty clear what is and isn't allowed.

The problem I have with this argument is that so many nasty words ARE allowed. There seem to be a few that CC take offence to, but words like "f**king", "c**t", "r****d" etc. are considered perfectly fine. If minors are on here, then shouldn't we ban these too?

From the Bigotry guidelines:

Bigotry includes racism, sexism, ageism, homophobia/sexual orientation bashing, religion bashing, lack of religion bashing, or wishing violence on any group of people, etc.
Bigotry takes into account historic events, emotional baggage and generally accepted associations with a term, phrase or intent - posting "White Power" in a topic has a history and is bigoted, posting "Green Power" makes you an environmentalist.

"Fucking" and "retard" are not terms which apply to any protected category above - no specific race, gender, orientation, or religion. Hence, they are allowed.

"Cunt" may be considered derogatory to women, but CC has determined many times that it is allowed.

If you use a word that is bigoted to one of the above protected groups, you will be warned. Still, for the 10th time, not sure how that is unclear in the least.

Posted: **Mon Jul 18, 2011 4:35 pm**

Pander88uk wrote:
TheForgivenOne wrote:
Pander88uk wrote:I can see your point jefjef, and yes that is an issue. But it's such an ambiguous rule, and many people don't know what is and isn't acceptable (yet are punished all the same).

Many people don't know of the Multi/Secret Diplomacy rule, yet they still get busted/Warned for it. Should we change that rule too? (I'm being serious here)

I have to disagree with that. When signing up for a new account there is a clear message:
"Warning: Having multiple accounts is considered cheating. We routinely scan for multiple accounts and offending members will be banned from Conquer Club."

The difference with SD as well is that once warned for that, or mentioned, then the person KNOWS not to do it again. It isn't ambiguous. Also, it's in the clear written rules, unlike what words are/are not allowed.

Really? I would bet a good amount of people just see a box and click it, thinking it reads "You agree to our TOS" or whatever most other sites ask you before you join.`

Posted: **Mon Jul 18, 2011 11:00 pm**

Sorry Dibbun, but the Bigotry guidelines are far from clear. First of all, the bolded parts show that the categories listed is not an exhaustive list, yet it is not clear which other groups would fall under this header (based on previous rulings, those with mental disabilities appearantly don't):

Bigotry includes racism, sexism, ageism, homophobia/sexual orientation bashing, religion bashing, lack of religion bashing, or wishing violence on any group of people, etc.
Bigotry takes into account historic events, emotional baggage and generally accepted associations with a term, phrase or intent - posting "White Power" in a topic has a history and is bigoted, posting "Green Power" makes you an environmentalist.

Secondly, the bigotry guidelines imply that it is forbidden to intentionally insult the entire group. However, warnings are handed out for using specific words against specific individuals when there is no intent whatsoever at insulting the entire group. Which words are considered so offensive that merely using them with the intention of offending a single individual is considered bigotry? Only the mods seem to know.

Posted: **Mon Jul 18, 2011 11:23 pm**

Pander88uk wrote:
TheForgivenOne wrote:
Pander88uk wrote:I can see your point jefjef, and yes that is an issue. But it's such an ambiguous rule, and many people don't know what is and isn't acceptable (yet are punished all the same).

Many people don't know of the Multi/Secret Diplomacy rule, yet they still get busted/Warned for it. Should we change that rule too? (I'm being serious here)

The difference with SD as well is that once warned for that, or mentioned, then the person KNOWS not to do it again.

Once warned for bigotry/racism then the person also KNOWS not to do it again...

Posted: **Mon Jul 18, 2011 11:30 pm**

jefjef wrote:
Pander88uk wrote:
TheForgivenOne wrote:
Pander88uk wrote:I can see your point jefjef, and yes that is an issue. But it's such an ambiguous rule, and many people don't know what is and isn't acceptable (yet are punished all the same).

Many people don't know of the Multi/Secret Diplomacy rule, yet they still get busted/Warned for it. Should we change that rule too? (I'm being serious here)

The difference with SD as well is that once warned for that, or mentioned, then the person KNOWS not to do it again.

Once warned for bigotry/racism then the person also KNOWS not to do it again...

But they don't know what will cross the line again. There is no list of banned terms or offensive words. If warned should a user disregard game chat all together so to not cross an imaginary wavy line?

Posted: **Mon Jul 18, 2011 11:45 pm**

George Carlin would have a fucking field day with this shit. What ever happened to the whole sticks n stones thing that was beaten into our skulls as children. Even if CC is trying to protect it younger members, they could they say, "now children you're rubber and they're glue, so whatever they say will bounce off of you and stick to them, so it's okay if they say cunt or homo, no need to get upset." Thats the kind of motherhood lessons I think CC should bestow upon the youth of the website.

Posted: **Tue Jul 19, 2011 12:35 am**

MichelSableheart wrote:Sorry Dibbun, but the Bigotry guidelines are far from clear. First of all, the bolded parts show that the categories listed is not an exhaustive list, yet it is not clear which other groups would fall under this header (based on previous rulings, those with mental disabilities appearantly don't):

Bigotry includes racism, sexism, ageism, homophobia/sexual orientation bashing, religion bashing, lack of religion bashing, or wishing violence on any group of people, etc.
Bigotry takes into account historic events, emotional baggage and generally accepted associations with a term, phrase or intent - posting "White Power" in a topic has a history and is bigoted, posting "Green Power" makes you an environmentalist.

Secondly, the bigotry guidelines imply that it is forbidden to intentionally insult the entire group. However, warnings are handed out for using specific words against specific individuals when there is no intent whatsoever at insulting the entire group. Which words are considered so offensive that merely using them with the intention of offending a single individual is considered bigotry? Only the mods seem to know.

Bold the whole line.

Bigotry includes racism, sexism, ageism, homophobia/sexual orientation bashing, religion bashing, lack of religion bashing, or wishing violence on any group of people, etc.

You shouldn't be wishing violence on anyone.

Basically if you are making a statement about the person's skill/ability/performance in the game, it's probably not bigoted. Like if you say that a person is a dumbass, a fool, a jerkoff, a fucking lameass carebear ezface noob, or even a retard - you're commenting on their actions.

If you are comparing them to a race, a sexual orientation, or a religion, especially if you're using a slur, then that's not allowed.

Posted: **Tue Jul 19, 2011 1:11 am**

But they don't know what will cross the line again. There is no list of banned terms or offensive words. If warned should a user disregard game chat all together so to not cross an imaginary wavy line?

Thats bs thinking and a cop out. In this day and age it's pretty obvious what terms are commonly and specifically used as BLATANT bigoted slurs and racism... Sure there are few (very few) instances where a couple of those words have a dual meaning - that is where intent/use comes into play and to be determined but to pretend when someone says "Your a f**" that they are calling you a pile of twigs or a cigarette is just bs.

There are a lot of things you can say in chat to get people going without resorting to bigotry or racism. I and others do it all the time. It isn't that hard to figure out.

This is a private business and CC does not want the blatant commonly used slurs on their site. I and many others do not blame them. Why would you even support or want slurs to be used?

Conquer Club

Stop banning specific words in game chat

Stop banning specific words in game chat

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